2007 AGA International Aquascaping Contest - Page 5 - Aquascaping

AaronT · 11-04-2007, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gomer

It was a wonderful turnout with tons of great tanks. I think it was said by Karen via emails, that this year we had the most tanks to judge and the least amount of time to do it. I think that showed through a bit in the amount that we were able to comment. I know I wanted to comment on a lot more but just didn't have time.

That said, I'd be happy to talk with anyone on any of the tanks.

I'd love to hear any comments / criticisms on my "Rotala Rainbow" tank please.

K Randall · 11-07-2007, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gomer

It was a wonderful turnout with tons of great tanks. I think it was said by Karen via emails, that this year we had the most tanks to judge and the least amount of time to do it. I think that showed through a bit in the amount that we were able to comment. I know I wanted to comment on a lot more but just didn't have time.

That said, I'd be happy to talk with anyone on any of the tanks.

I did say it, and boy, was this year a tough job! But I'm around too, and am happy to discuss tanks if people want.

Karen

Gomer · 11-04-2007, 03:51 PM

Aaron, please PM me the link and I'll reply back to you

Phil Edwards · 11-04-2007, 07:01 PM

I'm not quite sure what to think about this year's contest. It's obvious which of the aquascapes were entered by folks who placed very highly in the ADA contest. Unfortunately they more often than not got some of the highest prizes. I'm not saying that's a bad thing in general, but for some reason this year it's left a bad taste in my mouth. Overall I think the tanks were as good as last year's and the number of participants was fantastic! I've got to give all the judges serious credit for judging all of those in the short time allotted.

Even so, I'm sorely dissapointed in the biotope section this year. (Am I a broken record?) The setup Chong Ah Guan is the best biotope aquarium I have ever seen! Yes, there are far too many fish in that tiny aquarium, but I could otherwise swear I was swimming in the water with the fish. It seems that this is becoming more and more influenced by the aquascape portion than the biotope portion of the name where comparing it to more traditional aquascape standards is more important than aquascaping for a natural appearance.

Yeah, I'm a broken record.

Where were all the US participants? Are we getting enough internet activity and recognition from our forums? Are we not feeling up to par?

Overall I think the judging reflected the quality of the aquascapes and I was very happy to see more setups from people who weren't in the top 50 of the ADA contest. I'm kind of upset that some of the top ADA participants also participated in the AGA as it definitely skewed the data set, so to speak. Still, some of my favorite aquariums didn't place this year and were clearly designed and maintained by the "Everyman/Everywoman" aquarist.

Thank you all who participated. I look forward to joining you again next year.

Steven_Chong · 11-04-2007, 11:25 PM

^
You know what Phil-- I got a lot of respect for you but I got to tell you (and this is a bit of my bad mood talking) that I don't want to hear it.

Here's an American *pointing at himself* who entered 3 scapes into the contest that he worked very hard on. Including the 2nd place in Biotope, and so I'm a bit nerfed by your comment about the weakness of Biotope.

Also including my entry to the ADA Contest which by the way, beat both Wayne Sham and Alan Chan of CAU in that round. The cards fell differently by this judging panel, and I'm not going to cry about it-- those guys are great scapers too.

BUT I really don't want to hear anyone look down on the work of our American scapers because I know I for one gave it my all. If you think we didn't show well, then you should go and make the scape that will beat the pants off of all those foreigners.

Believe me, I'm going to keep trying as hard as hell too. I may not have done well this contest, but I'm only going to work to get better. If anything, I still feel the encouragement that at least Amano-sensei rated my work highly, and damn I'm going to work hard to not disappoint next year.

*edit* sigh, I can understand the sentiment about the ADA contest's impact on the AGA contest. Meh, maybe I won't enter the AGA contest next year then. :/

messy_da_legend · 11-04-2007, 11:55 PM

I think I agree with Phil about the high placing ADA tanks. I mean, the three that won the first 3 aquatic garden catagories were, guess what? High ranking ADA scapes, with the ADA winner getting best of show. Fine, they're awesome tanks and deserve to win, but it does leave you feeling a bit "meh" lol.

I wouldn't agree about the Biotopes being a disappointment, but Chong Ah Guan's tank was definitely my favourite there too. Jeff Senske's tank did nothing for me really, and the puffer wouldn't really fit long term. I did like Steven's idea of the Wabi Kusa though, as it's different and locally collected!

Tom

Phil Edwards · 11-05-2007, 04:41 AM

Steve,

Please don't misunderstand, I'm not complaining, I'm being curious. I saw a ton of participation from international aquascapers compared to people from the US. I'm curious to know why a lot of the people from the US didn't participate this year. For myself, because of a divorce and a very chaotic past year and a half I haven't been doing much in the way of aquarium keeping for the past two years. The fact of my lack of participation was I just didn't have anything to enter. I'm wondering what the reasons many of the other people who used to be standard participants aren't doing it anymore.

Across the board I was very pleased with the judging and feel that given the submissions and the judging criteria they were the proper choices. As far as the "ADA entries" goes it's clear that the difference between those entries and those of the rest of the field is huge. I'm glad to see such high quality participation but it also makes me sad because in some cases it left no opportunity for the rest of the participants.

On the biotope category. Given the criteria the judges have to work under the judging was proper. I like the #1 tank and think it's a very pretty aquascape with a very generalized "African Theme". Likewise with your Wabi Kusa. It's a gorgeous piece of work, was executed very well, and deserves the ranking it got under the current judging criteria. My dismay stems from the construct of the judging criteria where the aquascaping component of the rubric is still so heavily weighted and the general thought of "aquascape" means Aquatic Garden and not Natural Re-creation.

I apologize if you felt I was coming down on you or making less of your efforts. You're an outstanding aquatic artist and have done some pretty awesome stuff. Credit is due where credit is due.

K Randall · 11-07-2007, 02:28 PM

[quote=Phil Edwards;339727]

>>Even so, I'm sorely dissapointed in the biotope section this year. (Am I a broken record?) The setup Chong Ah Guan is the best biotope aquarium I have ever seen! <<

I agree. It was outstanding!

>>Yes, there are far too many fish in that tiny aquarium, but I could otherwise swear I was swimming in the water with the fish. It seems that this is becoming more and more influenced by the aquascape portion than the biotope portion of the name where comparing it to more traditional aquascape standards is more important than aquascaping for a natural appearance.

Yeah, I'm a broken record. <<

I think the only way to solve this problem would be to write different judging criteria for this class. I also think that whenever you have judging by comittee, you can get unexpected results. Not all judges have the same background knowledge of biotopes.

>>Overall I think the judging reflected the quality of the aquascapes and I was very happy to see more setups from people who weren't in the top 50 of the ADA contest. I'm kind of upset that some of the top ADA participants also participated in the AGA as it definitely skewed the data set, so to speak.<<

Well, it definitely wouldn't be fair for us to ban people from entering the AGA contest if they'd won the ADA contest would it? Most people who enter the AGA contest, ask for their aquascapes to be automatically forwarded on the the ADA contest in the spring. I knew there would be complaints about the top place tank, even while we were judging. But what were the alternatives? To place an astoundingly beautiful tank, which received consistently high marks from the judges, just because it had also won another contest? That doesn't seem fair either.

Whether people have noticed or not, there has always been a fair amount of overlap in enteries between the two contests. I'm surprised that this hasn't happened before, quite frankly. I think that one of the things that has kept it from happening before is that there are so many judges for the ADA contest that it is harder to get a consensus on "the best" tank. There was only one year that I believe 4 judges (out of about a dozen) agreed on the top tank in the ADA contest, and it wasn't this year.

I'd just like to give credit where credit is due, and congratulate the maker on a really exemplary tank.

Phil, is there something you don't like about this particular tank, or is it JUST that it won ADA also that bothers you?

Karen

Phil Edwards · 11-13-2007, 06:01 AM

[quote=K Randall;340248]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Edwards

I'd just like to give credit where credit is due, and congratulate the maker on a really exemplary tank.

Phil, is there something you don't like about this particular tank, or is it JUST that it won ADA also that bothers you?

Karen

Karen,

I've got nothing against the aquarium or the aquarist. It's a very very well done aquascape. The aquarist (I apologize for forgetting his name) did a fantastic job on it and, I agree, deserves recognition for his work. The difficulty I'm having is that it is SUCH a good aquascape that it's effectively the only option for 1st and Best of Show in the competition it's entered in. Automatic victory, everyone else go home, don't pass go, don't collect $200.00.

I'm not sure if you're familiar with NASCAR racing but a trend as built up over the past couple years of their highest division drivers (Nextel Cup) racing in their 2nd highest division (Busch, or used to be). These drivers routinely win the races and take the highest placing in the circuit to the detriment of the drivers who's greatest achievements to date have been racing in this 2nd division. They've worked their hardest only to have someone from a higher level of competition come in and ruin the level of competition for the field because they're so much better drivers. That's kind of how I'm seeing the situation with some of these entries. For the most part the level of this year's competition was very close in my eyes and could have gone in a million different directions if some entries weren't there. On some level it just feels to me like "stealing the show" and making light of an otherwise very competitive field.

Please don't misunderstand, I don't begrudge anyone their results; they were earned though all of the planning and work that went into the final aquascape. I know I'm an idealist and that the Ideal never truly exists.

I agree wholeheartedly with you about the need to have ADA entries in the AGA contest. Not only becuase of all the support ADA gives the AGA and also to support the aquatic gardening community as a whole. What I saw this year when browsing the entries were a lot of great aquariums in a level to give lots of competition then BANG, those super duper outstanding aquariums that had already placed highly in a extremely competetive environment. It's a conundrum, for sure, and one that I'm not sure has a solution.

K Randall · 11-14-2007, 02:43 PM

[quote=Phil Edwards;341384]

Quote:

Originally Posted by K Randall

I'm not sure if you're familiar with NASCAR racing but a trend as built up over the past couple years of their highest division drivers (Nextel Cup) racing in their 2nd highest division (Busch, or used to be). These drivers routinely win the races and take the highest placing in the circuit to the detriment of the drivers who's greatest achievements to date have been racing in this 2nd division. They've worked their hardest only to have someone from a higher level of competition come in and ruin the level of competition for the field because they're so much better drivers. That's kind of how I'm seeing the situation with some of these entries. For the most part the level of this year's competition was very close in my eyes and could have gone in a million different directions if some entries weren't there. On some level it just feels to me like "stealing the show" and making light of an otherwise very competitive field.

Hi Phil,

One thing you have to remember, though, is that most people (if not all... I can't remember the timing to the day!) have already entered the AGA contest before they even KNOW where they stand in the ADA contest. I am sure there was no intent to "steal the show" in this case. And it is somewhat self-limiting, because you can't enter exactly the same aquascape two years in a row.

You can't really compare it to NASCAR, at this point... NO ONE has won these contests multiple times yet. And this is the first time we've had the same person, let alone the same tank win both contests.

And if you are insinuating that the AGA contest is "division 2", I resemble that remark!<g>

Karen