Inducing blooming in crypts with far red light - Page 4 - Cryptocorynes

DeChaoOrdo · 01-14-2012, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex Gal

DeChaoOrdo - I think the problem here is that it's very clear to the reader what HeyPK is doing. This isn't a science lab. HeyPK isn't claiming that. He also doesn't say that his results aren't anecdotal. To say that anecdotal evidence has not merit is just as incorrect. It's the anecdotal evidence that spurs people on to the experiments in the lab. Besides what HeyPK is doing doesn't have a down side. It doesn't hurt the plant, it also runs along with current literature and it's interesting.

All of us in this hobby have MOSTLY anecdotal evidence for the things we do in our tanks. We don't have labs. We don't set up elaborate experiments with control groups. We do what has worked anecdotally in our tanks. It's best to not be negative and just recognize that HeyPK is just doing something interesting at home and telling us about it.

I understand your point, but drawing conclusions off of experiments like this is what led to the common misconception that phosphates create algae and others like it. Again, I am not saying this experiment is meritless, simply inconclusive. Running experiments like this leads to a strong possibility of conflating correlation and causation which is why anecdotal evidence is such anathema in science.

A few more iterations with rest periods between would certainly strengthen the conclusiveness, though. Keeping documentation on the other parameters would strengthen it even more(and make it reproducible). Making a proper experiment doesn't require lab quality instruments(though they make it more reliable) simply lab quality procedures.

Tex Gal · 01-14-2012, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeChaoOrdo

I understand your point, but drawing conclusions off of experiments like this is what led to the common misconception that phosphates create algae and others like it. Again, I am not saying this experiment is meritless, simply inconclusive. Running experiments like this leads to a strong possibility of conflating correlation and causation which is why anecdotal evidence is such anathema in science.

A few more iterations with rest periods between would certainly strengthen the conclusiveness, though. Keeping documentation on the other parameters would strengthen it even more(and make it reproducible). Making a proper experiment doesn't require lab quality instruments(though they make it more reliable) simply lab quality procedures.

Well at least you are a little more positive - with lots of negatives thrown in. No, I don't think you understood my point. If you'd like him to fine tune what he is doing that is a much more positive approach. My mom always said, "You can catch more bees with honey than with vinegar." That means keep it positive. If what you are saying sounds offensive to people - you are using vinegar. It's much better not to be a discouragement to people.

illustrator · 01-17-2012, 09:57 AM

Some crypts are flowering easily and we don't need anything new. Others flower infrequently or very rarely, and if someone tries something that seems to work, other can try the same and then we actually have a wide variety of growing circumstances and just one thing which we all do in addition to what we did before. With tropical species (with 12 hour day 12 hour night) I am not convinced why far red light would induce flowering, but I'd love it if someone has an idea which might get C. affinis to flower repeatedly.

For now, I am reading this with great interest and wait for anyone to try with some more species. Anecdotical evidence is an excellent basis for starting experiments, sure, in itself it is not enough to draw firm comclusions, but without anecdotical evidence, I believe we would have far less interesting scientific work being done.

HeyPK · 01-17-2012, 02:38 PM

I have decided to shell out about $160.00 for a powerful far red light source, and will be doing some more experiments in the next few months. Right now the C. minima is back to not-blooming, and the C. longicauda never did bloom. If I could get my hands on a C. affinis plant, I could try the far-red light on that, too. HINT! HINT!

wabisabi · 04-09-2012, 11:01 AM

Any updates on this project?

HeyPK · 04-09-2012, 11:54 AM

Not much from me. My job has gotten in the way of my hobby, as usual, and all I have done is move the two species into a 15 gallon aquarium. I still have to get a light on the tank and buy the far red lamp.

"Work is the curse of the drinking classes"----Oscar Wilde

wabisabi · 04-11-2012, 12:28 AM

Damn work! Always getting in the way of important stuff.....like our hobbies!

If you commit and buy the far red lamp, I'll donate a small C. affinis plant to this cause.