[Wet Thumb Forum]-Trying to grow large Java Fern without dosing ferts

[Dave12]

Natural Method Guru's

Have set up a 250 litre tank about 3 Months ago, following the advice in Ms Walstads excellent book, pretty much to the letter(Although I have to add Ca, Mg, and K as I have very soft water) . All plants are growing spectacularly well except my previously weed-like Java Ferns.

While all new leaves are large and healthy, the plants don't seem to be able to maintain their older leaves and these die off at about the same rate as new leaves grow.

So to my Question.... Is it possible to grow non-rooted plants, such as Java Ferns without dosing ?(I'm thinking Nitrate dosing specifically)

Regards
Dave M
New Zealand

[Dave12]

Natural Method Guru's

Have set up a 250 litre tank about 3 Months ago, following the advice in Ms Walstads excellent book, pretty much to the letter(Although I have to add Ca, Mg, and K as I have very soft water) . All plants are growing spectacularly well except my previously weed-like Java Ferns.

While all new leaves are large and healthy, the plants don't seem to be able to maintain their older leaves and these die off at about the same rate as new leaves grow.

So to my Question.... Is it possible to grow non-rooted plants, such as Java Ferns without dosing ?(I'm thinking Nitrate dosing specifically)

Regards
Dave M
New Zealand

[Roger Miller]

Nitrate *shouldn't* be a problem as long as you have a good fish population and feed them well. All rules have their exceptions, but I would look for other causes before dosing nitrate.

Could the older leaves be suffering damage from rasping fish -- a pleco for instance?


Roger Miller

------------
"The indispensible first step to getting the things you want out of life is this: Decide what you want" -- Ben Stein

[Em\'sDad]

I think the answer is definitely "yes"!

I set up a simple 29 gallon tank in my office mainly to deal with an overflow of livebearer offspring. Absolutely nothing special. ~1 watt per gallon, no CO2, Fluorite/gravel 1:1 substrate. It has a natural cork background and some driftwood. I couldn't bear the thought of no plants, so I have Java fern, Java moss, Bolbitis and a few bronze Wendtii crypts. pH is consistently ~6.8 and the local water is very soft. It has a reasonably heavy fish load and I have never dosed anything. The crypts and bolbitis I would describe as "slow but healthy" (perfect for my ideal of a minimum maintenance tank) but the Java ferns are going beserk and appear far healthier than those in my two other planted tanks.

I can't particularly explain why, but it's definitely possible!

Roger

[Dave12]

Thank you for the kind advice

Roger

No raspers in this tank, only Siamensis and non raspers. Also leaves are old and yellow looking, but undamaged

EM's Dad

I think that the other plants are growing so well, because of the rich soil substrate, that there is little left in the water column to support old and new leaves on these quite large ferns. This is not specific to the Javas as my floating Water Sprite grows the same, ie good large new leaves and rapidly dying older leaves.
The plants get bigger just not bushier.

Regards
Dave M
New Zealand

[anonapersona]

Have any of the new leaves grown under the new tank conditions begun to look bad? Or is it only the leaves "born" in the other tank that are ill? Perhaps the plant just needs to shed leaves that are not adapted to the new tank.

[nativeplanter]

anonapersona's question is excellent. If your plants were purchased new when you set up the tank, it's not surprising that many of the old leaves are dying. Many plants are grown emersed by the companies that grow them, since they grow faster that way. But the leaves on the plants are'nt well adapted to live under water. When placed in deeper water, the plants will grow new leaves and will shed the old ones. This is especially prevalent in rosette plants like swords.

-Laura

[Leopardess]

Are the older leaves producing any adventitious babies? If so, they might be dying of "old age."

Don't lose hope It can be done. I don't fertilize and my Java grows like weeds. I can't offer much help - but I wanted to let you know "Don't give up!"



Click here to see my tanks!

[Dave12]

Thanks to everyone for the responses.

anonapersona

Good point, only leaves grown in my old tank are dying, time will tell how the long the new leaves last.


nativeplanter

Plants were originally grown in another tank by me. In that tank, nitrates were much higher due to greater Bio-filtering and the ferns grew well, hence the dosing question.


Leopardess

Older, dying leaves do not have babies, in fact no new leaf babies have been produced in the newer tank, a fact that I hadn't noticed.

Regards
Dave M
New Zealand