DataGuru

So Diana, are your article and tank pics moving here?

We oughta put together a sticky for this forum with an intro and links to resources.

With my other little 2.5 gallon here at home, I used that topsoil that had the ammonia/bubbling issues and planted e-tennelus and crypts and didn't add a lot of floaters to suck up the excess nutrients. That's the only NPT that I've had pea soup algae in. I used daphnia for a while which was kinda nice actually, cuz it was a nice ecosystem for the betta with built in food and they finally cleared it, but with the lack of daphnia food, the betta ate enough daphnia, the green water returned. I added more daphnia and najas grass and the algae has not returned. So perhaps even with an overly nutritious substrate, fast growing floaters can keep algae blooms from happening.

 

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Jane in Upton

My suggestion to avoid potting soils with an added fertilizer (especially for one's first foray into using soil underlayers) was based on the El Natural methodology - the ideal soil will have nutrients, but in moderation. Just as the addition of composted manure is also not advised, the additional fertilizer in supplemented potting soils is considered excessive for an El Natural setup. In this type of setup, fertilizers are not added straight to the water column, either - the addition of fishfood, and its degradation by bacteria provide the main source of macronutrients for the plants.

There were a few cases where folks used a fertilizer-enriched potting soil in an El Natural setup, and they had great difficulty with their tanks, many times greater than the "usual" problems encountered as an El Natural soil underlayer is "settling in".

If the parameters are changed, such as the addition of CO2 supplementation or water column fertilization is added, then Miracle Gro potting soil with fertilizers might be just the right thing. But that's a very different setup.

-Jane

Jimbo205

While reading the above posts, I am able to understand what Jane, Betty and Diana said.
Can someone translate what PlantBrain said?
I did not understand his post.

Thanks.

banderbe

He said that excess nutrients (NPK and traces) don't cause algae but excess ammonia (NH4) does, and he's right.

dwalstad

There are plenty of river and oceanic algal blooms due to nitrate and phosphate pollution that would contradict a blanket statement like this.

Although algae (like aquatic plants) prefer ammonia to nitrogen, algae can grow very well with nitrates alone.

Some of the cyanobacteria (blue-green algae) can actually use atmospheric nitrogen for all their nitrogen needs.

In aquariums due to the fishfood input, there's generally an excess of all nutrients. Iron being much less soluble than other nutrients can, in this situtation, limit algal (see my book, pages 169-170).

What stimulates algae depends upon the situation.

banderbe

I guess the statement should be qualified:

He said that (assuming your tank is full of healthy plants) excess nutrients (NPK and traces) don't cause algae but excess ammonia (NH4) does, and he's right.

That certainly fits with my experience. I can have 30+ ppm NO3 and 4 to 5 ppm PO4 and if my plants are happy I have virtually no algae.

I think you're right though that it depends on the situation; in a tank without plants algae can gain a foothold easily.

Jimbo205

Diana, when I have trimmed my plants or rather taken them out of the tank to decide what to do with them I have been taking the old parts with algae on them or whichever plants I do not want to keep anymore and crush them and bury them under the substrate. I remember your book talking about available carbon through decomposition and the amount of carbon absorbed by the plant and therefore available to other plants while breaking down.

I am taking baby steps in trying to learn the mind boggling amount of methods to grow aquarium plants. Sometimes I think I must be nuts trying to make this hobby work. Square Foot Gardening for tomatoes and vegetables is cake compared to this stuff somedays.

Please tell me that someday this will all be easy. (Without also achieving a college degree in biology and / or chemistry). I just want a beautiful aquarium. (smile)

dwalstad

Believe me, I wouldn't have kept 3-9 tanks for last 19 years if it was that time-consuming!

I tried to write my book on a High School level of biology and chemistry. It's not stuff you can skim, but it shouldn't be too hard to understand.

I've never tried burying fresh plant matter in substrate. It could help (provide CO2). But it could also cause wild decomposition in the soil, because it is so fresh. Fresh organic matter like plants is like Fast Food for bacteria. I would have chosen something less tasty for bacteria (composted organic matter, peat moss, etc), so that you don't set up massive decomposition and anaerobic conditions in the substrate.

It might be prudent to wait several weeks after your first addition to see what happens before you add anymore.

Let us know what happens. Interesting idea for revitalizing old substrates!



Let us know if you think it helps. Interesting idea.

Jimbo205

That would be good bacteria and not bad bacteria, correct?

Bottom line to me is - will it make my Mollies sick?

I have cleared out 1/3 of my 10 gallon tank because I think the lush growth of my plants was causing crowding my Mollies and causing them stress.

I have been losing about 1 Molly a week in either one tank or the other.
I just lost a 2 inch gorgeous Black Lyretail Molly.
The other Mollies again look fine and so do the 4 new neons that I added.

I have been using the Daily Dosage Schedule with my Seachem products, but wanted to slowly incorporate some things I learned from your book.

Should I take the mulm out, let it dry and then put it beneath the substrate afterwards? I thought this stuff and excess fish food was good.

(It has been 20 years since High School.)

Hmm.....

DataGuru

Jimbo: I haven't had good luck at all with Mollies. At first I thought it was something about the NPT, but then I lost more new mollies in a regular tank. Given my experience with them, I really think Mollies are not robust fish.

Thanks for adding the sticky John.

 

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