only120xs

Just started my first NPT:



I know I don't have a lot of plant mass, but I was wondering if there's enough to support any fish? It's a 46g tank.

Thanks

Plants (clockwise from upper left):
unpsecified sword
unpsecified sword
Anubias coffeefolia
Echindorus Ozelot
Java fern
Windilov (Microsorium pteropus)
Wendtii red

Dustymac

Welcome!

Plants do a lot in an aquarium. In addition to soaking up ammonia and spitting out oxygen, they strip nutrients from the water that can support algae growth. I suspect you have about 1/100th the amount of plant mass in your 46 as I have in my 45, and mine has about 20 fish. Since you can't really get by with only 1/5th of a fish, I'm thinking you need lots more plants.

Or you can approach your setup as a fish-only tank, at least until your plants start to mature. This means traditional filtration and/or lots of water changes. Regardless, I would cover 1/3 of the surface with floating plants to help pull algae-growing nutrients from the water.

Good luck!
Jim

only120xs

Thanks. That confirms my thoughts, so I guess I'll skip the fish for a while and get more plants as I can.

I think I'm going to hook up my HOB filter with a carbon filter to try to clear up the water though. Maybe run it at night so I don't have to listen to it.



The tank was set up Friday night, so I thought I'd check the water params just in case. Here's what I have:
pH: 7.0
GH: 5
NO2: 0
NH3: 0
NO3: 0

Looks good, right? Is that hardness OK, or should I add some coral to the substrate?

Dustymac

I'm sorry if I scared you into delaying the introduction of fish; that wasn't my intent. There is a certain symbiosis between fish and plants and without the fish, your plants won't grow as fast. I would start with a few small fish, a couple medium fish, or one larger fish. As long as you have an ammonia/nitrite test kit, you can monitor any potentially dangerous nitrogen levels.

Great! But I have reservations about starting and stopping filters where the water can sit stagnant for several hours at a time. It just seems to me that bad stuff can happen to that water among all that organic material. Of course, I don't know for sure; it's just an inkling of mine. Maybe someone can add their expertise on this issue.

I would boost your hardness a bit. According to Ecology of the Planted Aquarium, your hardness should be at least 8. And yes, it does look good. Keep the pics coming!

Jim

dwalstad

I want to commend you for your nice photos. This kind of well-organized information makes it much easier to weigh in.

A water change might reduce some of that faint turbidity. Also, I see you've planted your Java Fern. (Usually, these plants are tied to rocks or driftwood.) Your plant's rhizomes may rot if they're buried in a soil/gravel substrate like this? You might want to rubber band it to a small rock or the plumbing in your tank.

Most importantly, I see a lot of empty water here for such a small plant mass. Here's something you could try that might help. Reduce your water level temporarily (2-3 months and/or until you get robust plant growth). Benefits:

• Water itself absorbs a great deal of light. By reducing the water level, your plants will get more light. It may not matter for the Java fern, Anubia, Crypts, but it will greatly help your swordplants. (I've found that one robust swordplant can make all the difference with algae control.)
  
• You'll automatically increase your plant mass to water ratio. The plants you have will have more impact on the ecosystem in a smaller volume of water. Right now that huge volume of water on top of the plants looks like a perfect potential breeding ground for green water algae.
  
• Any water changes will be easier.

I've done this myself for my new 5 gal tank. See attached photo.

Attached Thumbnails

 

mudboots

Sweet thread!!! I was just wondering about my 10 npt because the plants haven't grown in yet and I can't stand the emptiness in the top 2/3 of the water column. I'll take Dwalstad's advice and roll on.

BTW only120xs, I'm sending you a pm on some potential plants, pending your long-term scape outlook.

davemonkey

For NPT I think you should plant heavier. A few groups of stem plants in the mix will help out greatly, of coarse those swords will eventually take over and the stems will be obsolete.

Get those rhizomes out of the substrate (the anubias and java ferns). They will eventually send roots down into the soil, but the rhizome has to be above ground to survive. I tie my epiphytes to small stones and sink the stones into the substrate. That way they look planted, but really aren't. After a few weeks the plants have shot roots down into the soil and all is well.

Great start on a NPT!

-Dave

only120xs

Thanks everyone! Lots of stuff I didn't know.

So, I've lowered the water level as much as I can (maybe half to 2/3 of the last pic), attached a filter, and stuck the Java fern under the rock.

I'll pull the Coffeefolia out of the dirt and add some coral to the gravel. I'm going to wait till at least next week to get fish; I do have that giant snail in there though.

The filter doesn't seem to be doing much for the water, so I'll probably remove it at the end of the week.

Dave - Yeah, I know it's not enough plants; I would have gotten more if I could have afforded it!

I hope to get some plants from a friend in the next week or two, and thanks for the offer Mudboots, I'll respond shortly!

only120xs

Just thought I'd add some more photos:

From 10/20/09


10/23/09: Got some Marsilea and Hygrophyla bold:


10/25/09: A couple of fish in there now. Some of the Marsilea is dying off, but hopefully it's just the weak parts.

dwalstad

Funny, but I too just bought some Marsilea quadrifolia. The vendor (AquariumPlants.com) went out of their way advising me to cut off all the foliage to 1/4 inch (or less) above the rim of the pot. [No warning like this about other emersed plants (e.g., Hemianthus callictroides) I've received from them. Apparently, Marsilea will need to grow all new submerged leaves from the remaining root mass. When I got the plant, it had a beautiful thick mass of stems/leaves 3-4 inches high. I hated cutting it off.

Some plant species that are grown emersed adapt better than others to the submerged condition.

I see that your tank water was a little color tinted on 10/23. It could be leachings from the dying Marsilea leaves and/or tannins from the soil. Whatever the source, it looks like you've done a water change to clear things up.

That's great you got more plants. Nice work!