[Wet Thumb Forum]-Interesting article about green water in ponds --

[anonapersona]

GREEN WATER by Norm Meck

This is the followup to an article I'd read long ago and lost track of. I'm really happy to see it resurface as I'd like to see what the guys here think about this and how this might relate to green water in aquariums.

I'm particularly interested in the last few paragraphs, as that is where he goes past my ability to understand the implications he suggests.

[anonapersona]

GREEN WATER by Norm Meck

This is the followup to an article I'd read long ago and lost track of. I'm really happy to see it resurface as I'd like to see what the guys here think about this and how this might relate to green water in aquariums.

I'm particularly interested in the last few paragraphs, as that is where he goes past my ability to understand the implications he suggests.

[wetmanNY]

anona, I thought that the author got off track by not taking into consideration the role of the plankton-- easily overlooked in aquaria, too.

I've been getting a lot of stimulation out of a 1998 article about shallow natural ponds that offers new ways (to me) of thinking about the alternate states of turbid green water versus dense planting with clear water, how each dynamic state is "buffered" by some of its own characteristics, which tend to stabilize it, and how each dynamic equilibrium can be "switched" to the alternate set of conditions.

The interactors are familiar in our aquaria: plankton (rotifers and copepods in aquaria, more efficient filter-feeding cladocera in lentic natural waters), planktivorous/piscivorous/herbivorous fish species (we make community choices, they control the make-up of populations through predation), and the refugia for zooplankton that dense plantings offer.

I hope you folks will read the article, with planted aquaria constantly in mind: http://www.ceep-phosphates.org/scope...e29/chap1.html

I _like_ this article since it addresses the shallow lake notion that is often overlooked.

Some ref's for shallow lake macrophyte-phytoplankton algae interactions are by Canfield here at UF. Florida is loaded with many shallow lakes(Almost 8000 of them) and they act quite differently and are more complex that pelagic deep water lakes and northern coldwater seasonal lake ecosystems.

When you get around 30-50% macrophyte coverage in lakes, gues what? The water turns clean(Canfield).
Folks here have known this for many years.

But lake owners moan about the weeds for their boats and then ask for triploid sterile Grass carp to control their weed issues then get murky green pea soup. Then they complain about that

They want it both ways but this is not going to happen.
Regards,
Tom Barr

[anonapersona]

So, the difference is the critters that are allowed to find shelter in the plants? (trying to take this back down to the layman's terms) Norm Meck seemed to think it had to do with the filter and the stuff growing there, but this article (being about filterless ponds) skips over that of course. So, the things that eat green water are important, now how does one culture those things in a tank? (just conversing for fun here, my pond has cleared after it turned green with no real help from me)

Daphnia are great at controlling green water.

Folks might just want to wait a bit during there seasonal cycles in their ponds or add 30-50% plant coverage right at the start of the season.

Then you'll never have GW. I've done this with my Dad's pond. He's never had GW once.

Gives a good place for the Koi to hide from those damn Coons(and also herons and other birds). We took care of them with an electric fence.

There are some very simple things folks can do to prevent GW in their ponds but folks want to sell things(UV's, Barley straw, copper sulfate, expensive filters etc)or/and have attitudes that don't accept natural cycles. Humans should use what nature has to offer as a solution to their desires.

Ponds can look very nice and have a fair amount of plants and never any GW.

But that notion doesn't sell like UV's. Daphnia either.

Regards,
Tom Barr