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Fertilizing Science of Aquatic Fertilizing - Discuss fertilizing techniques and proper aquatic plant nutrition here.

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Old 05-22-2008, 01:08 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Fertilator use question

I was looking at the "Fertilator" as I am making the switch from the SeaChem line to dry. When I checked the recommended dose schedule for the flourish line with the "concentrations from chemicals added" I get really low concentrations. It looks like I should be adding 10 times what is recommended to get to the right concentrations..
I'm I reading that right?

I've not been happy with the flourish line. I'm new to planted tanks, and I thought it would be easier to learn using their products.
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Old 05-22-2008, 03:22 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fertilator use question

There's some problems with the fertilator and Seachem's line of ferts that are in the process of being fixed at the moment. Iron is listed as one of the nutrients in several of Seachem's ferts that really don't contain any iron at all.

The FertFriend calculator may be helpful to you: http://www.fishfriend.com/fertfriend.html

There's a Seachem fert calculator embedded in this thread. It mentions some ways that you can use it and ways that you can modify it.

Last edited by Left C : 05-23-2008 at 03:03 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 05-22-2008, 04:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fertilator use question

Using a volume calculator I have a tank with 190 liters of water.
the recommended dose of nitrogen is 3.1ml , the FertFriend gives 1.2344ppm of Nitrate. the target levels are "NO3 : 5 - 30 ppm" . So shouldn't I add more like 30ml? I tested the water before adding the seachem nitrogen and after. The nitrate levels were zero.
The same with Phosphorus. Recommended dose is 3.1ml, giving 0.7491 ppm, target levels are1.0-2.0ppm. this is closer, but I just got a api phosphate test kit and that shows zero, the post adding seachem phosphorus was a bit darker.
The seachem iron is on the mark. adding 5 ml gives 0.2631ppm, target 0.1-1.0 ppm
So have I been under dosing?
I do have some various lovely algae which prompted me to look into the fertilizers and balance...
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Old 05-23-2008, 01:05 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fertilator use question

You didn't mention anything about your lighting and CO2 use. Your water parameters would be useful too if you are using a calibrated test kit.

Adding more Flourish products depends on your lighting and CO2 use. Excel can be used to help with carbon needs and to kill or slow down algae.

The link that I gave you to the Seachem calculator says that if you want to dose more, just enter more gallons and you will be getting a higher dose. There's a lot of good info those two threads. If you get a chance, read them all.

The Seachem calculator and their chart are made for basically low light to moderate light low maintenance tanks, but it is very easily modified.

If you have high light and CO2, you might want to up the dosing so that you are dosing 20 to 30 ppm of NO3 per week and around 3 ppm of PO4 per week or even switching to dry ferts and dosing these amounts.

A word of advice though. Seachem F. Nitrogen is made of ammonium and nitrate (urae in the form of an iminium salt and potassium nitrate). When you test the water with a nitrate test kit, you will basically be measuring half of what nitrogen is in the aquarium. So, you double the measured amount of nitrate to approximate the actual nitrate level. This comes from Post #2: http://www.seachem.com/support/forum...urish+nitrogen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech Support CH View Post
The levels for planted aquariums that most people agree on are:
CO2 10-25 ppm
Nitrate 5-30 mg/L
Potassium 10-30 ppm
Phosphate 1-2 mg/L
Iron 0.2-0.5 or higher if using a chelated iron (Flourish Iron is not chelated)
...
If you are using Flourish Nitrogen to add nitrogen you should only expect your Nitrate reading to be half of what is suggested above. The reason is that half of the Flourish Nitrogen in in the ammoniacal form which most plants prefer.
From the F. Nitrogen bottle or the directions: http://www.seachem.com/products/prod...hNitrogen.html
"To target a specific nitrogen increase, dose according to the following formula: 0.25vn=m, where v= volume of tank in gallons*, n=desired nitrogen increase (if using a “nitrate equivalent” value for “n” then use a factor of 0.05 instead of 0.25 in the formula) and m=volume of product to use in mL. For example to raise 20 gallons* by 0.20 mg/L nitrogen you would use: 0.25*20*0.20=1 mL."

You use 0.05 in the formula instead of 0.25 because you want to find the "nitrate equivalent" with your test kit. As an example, you want to raise 190 liters of water or 50.2 US gallons of water by 7 ppm of NO3. The formula is 0.05vn=m

nitrate equivalent = 0.05
v = 190 liters ÷ 3.785 US gallons per liter = 50.2 US gallons
nitrate increase wanted is 7 ppm
m = mL of F. Nitrogen to add

Then: 0.05vn = 0.05 x 50.2 x 7 = 17.57 mL of F. Nitrogen can be added to increase NO3 levels in 190 liters of water by 7 ppm.

Does all this jabber help you some, willow52?

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Last edited by Left C : 05-23-2008 at 03:09 PM. Reason: minor wording changes
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Old 05-24-2008, 07:18 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fertilator use question


I am having fun... I am having fun.

What I'm trying to do is to start slow, and I'm finding my brain is really being challenged.

I think if I put this into writing it will help.. me.

I understand that the idea is to balance. Whatever the 'level', they need to be balanced. My impression is that the popular concept is to do everything in excess and then to do a major water change to 'reset' the balance. OK, fair enough.
I'd like to start a little slower.
I have a 48x17x19; 67.1 gal tank with 3" of EcoComplete (56.5 gal) filled to 3" from the top; 45.9 gallons volume.
I have a 4 strip t5 light with (54x4) 208 possible watts, but I'm now only running two of the lights for eight hours.
I have it pretty well planted. I got a package plant pack, and figured I'd just find out what would and wouldn't grow.
I have 8 neons, 8 zebra Danois and 10 Gold tetras, but I have a history of killing off fish and didn't expect them all to live... I had two ottos, but I think one of them may still be in there..
I'm using Excell.
pH 7.3
GH 6
KH 3
API tests zero for NH+, N03, N02 and Phosphates

I have some sorted algae, nothing taking over, yet...

so now to find the balance with a moderate level of maintance.
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Old 05-24-2008, 04:36 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Fertilator use question

You have no CO2 with your ~ 4 wpg lighting. Excel will help some, but this could be your #1 problem. If CO2 is 100%, Excel is around 60% to 70%.

You are showing 0 for your NO3 and PO4 testing results. This can easily lead to problems with algae and poor growth as well.

These are some parameters that you should shoot for (from http://www.barrreport.com/estimative...y-folks.html):
CO2 range 25-35 ppm
NO3 range 10-30 ppm
K+ range 10-30 ppm
PO4 range 1.0-2.0 ppm
Fe 0.2-0.5ppm or higher
GH range 1-2 degrees "extra" 17-40 ppm or higher

Adjust your dosings so that you are in these ranges.

You can easily use the fertfriend, fertilator and Chuck's fert dosing calculator to help you.

I recently read that someone dosed 20 to 30 pm of Nitrate per week and 3 ppm of PO4 per week in a high light tank with pressurized CO2.
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