dynafire

I tested my water tonight and my Ca and Mg extremely high.

My water param:
Ph: 7
No2-:0ppm
No3-:5ppm (not sure how accurate the API test kit is)
NH3/Nh4+: 0ppm
Po4: 0.5 (nutrafin test kit)
Kh:4
Gh: 7dgh
Ca: 60ppm (API test kit with 3 drop of second bottle)
Mg: 88.43ppm (from calculation)

Is this reasonable? I am also seeing some Ca deficiency symptoms. (deformed leaves on new growth and they are a lot smaller than old growth) I am dosing 5ml of pps pro each day to ~50g of water.

I am planning on doing 50% pure r/o water change tomorrow to reduce the ca and mg level. Will that work?

Thanks in advance,
dynafire

Seattle_Aquarist

Hi dynafire,

I don't understand how you can have the levels of Ca and Mg that you indicate and be showing signs of Ca deficiency. Does your area typically have very "hard" water? I have problems with Ca and Mg deficiencies here in Seattle, but our water is very, very, soft.

dynafire

I do not understand why there are signs of ca deficiencies either. My water is pretty soft last time i checked. I would have taken a picture but my sis. took my camera with her so I am in a pickle at this point. I will post a picture as soon as I get my camera back. On the side note, what should my water param. be at end of the day when doing pps pro? Is it safe to increase the dosage if I want more rapid growth with high light and co2 injection?

Thanks
David

Seattle_Aquarist

Hi dynafire,

When I first started planted tanks a little over a year ago I used the Seachem line. It worked great but as I added a couple of more tanks it started to get expensive. Then I went to PPS-Pro, which worked well but I had problems with plant deficiencies and slow growth. I started the EI method about a month ago and so far it has been the best. I have been having excellent plant growth, including my first Anubias flower. With all the extra growth, I discoved my Ca and Mg deficiencies become more evident, probably due to the faster growth rates.

If it were me, I would try doing some CaCl (Calcium Chloride) and MgSO4 (Epsom Salt) and see it the problem diminishes. I usually see improvement in a week or so after dosing. I dose the above per Rex Grigg's dosing recommendation. http://www.bestaquariumregulator.com/dosing.html

Philosophos

Your Ca and Mg are very high. So high that I wouldn't worry about it, unless your Ca is coming from CaCO3. I see something else off here, without a doubt; your NO3 is low, your PO4 high. If you increase PO4 levels high enough, NO3 uptake will increase. Once you dose enough NO3, I'm willing to bet that your red plants will turn green.

Also, look at your CO2... odds are you don't have enough of it. Right now, it's an extremely typical problem in the hobby given all the over-watted light around. A lack of CO2 looks stunningly like a lack of Ca in some ways, given that both are vital for plant structure.

What's going on for dosing with your K+? Also, what're your hardware specs with regards to lighting, column volume, and CO2?

-Philosophos

dynafire

Hi Philosophos,

I just remembered that I have some crushed corals in my filter. (That could be why for the high Ca level) My LFS recommended me to add some crushed corals because my Ph was kind of low when I was cycling my tank. But anyways, I am not totally sure if my No3 is correct. I tried to calibrate the test kit with a known No3 value but the color does not match up with the card. I even went to the extremes to test the kit using less than 2oz of r/o water with 1/4 tsp of KNo3 and the test shows 10ppm. So I don't know if I can trust my No3 numbers. As for K+ I am using K2SO4.

But here is my setup:
Tank: 29g show tank connected to a 20g holding tank with 20g diy sump (total volume of water is around 50g with about 3in of eco-complete in both 29 and 20)
Heater: 300w stealth heater
Light: 36" 4x39w T5 hang at 8in. above the 29g
Bulb: 2 midday, 1 aquaflora and 1 power grow (had two aquaflora before but the tank is yellow looking so I switch one out)
Co2: 25lb pressurized with diy reactor.

Routine:
Light: On from 12-3 and 5-10
Dosage: 5ml pps pro and 5ml csm+b everyday
Co2 level: I have a drop checker with 4dkh solution which seems to stay at blue-green color even though my bubble counter is at about 15bps.
WC once every two weeks

If you need more info about the set up please ask.

Thanks

Philosophos

Ya... they'll do stuff like that to you. I wouldn't listen to them. Your pH shouldn't be a problem with most amazonian fish unless you're dropping down below 6pH (often lower) and you've got a lack of trace essential to osmotic pressure, which won't happen anyhow if you've got enough ferts in the water. Don't go chasing KH goals around. Your bag of CaCO3 also has a frustratingly low level of bioavailable calcium. Take it out, start dosing CaSO4 or CaCL2.

If you can't trust the test kit, get a new one or move to EI style dosing. PMDD is hard to do without test kits. You could even hybridize and re-top the nutrients monthly to the desired level with one 50% WC.

Your light level is insanely high for your CO2. Work on getting better CO2 diffusion; bubble count means nothing if the distribution isn't there. Try playing with 1/2 the level of light if you're getting overwhelmed. Contrary to popular opinion, you can grow, "high light" plants in low light; it's about CO2, and simply keeping about 40-50mmol PAR delivered to each plant as a base line.

-Philosophos

dynafire

I just spend the whole day messing with the tank. I basically upgrade the display tank to 40g breeder. I added about 20g of r/o water and top it off with my old water. All dosing is on hold right now until I figure out how to dose. I need to order some CaSO4 or CaCL2. Btw which one is safer and more convenient to use from your experience?



What do you mean by "hybridize"?

I am trying to fix that each day by increasing the co2. I am using the diy reactor design from this forum and almost everyone is giving positive feedback. As for me, I don't know what I am doing wrong for the reactor not to function at its optimal level. Too much or not enough flow through the reactor? No bioballs inside the chamber? I am currently testing these out. If I decrease my lighting then should I go with 3 bulbs? Which ones should I take out?




-dynafire

dynafire

Hi Seattle_Aquarist,

I have tried the EI method with my first experiment with a planted tank. I have to admit that the plants grow well but I had a lot of algae issues and got tired of dealing with it an tore it down. I am giving another shot at the tank with pps pro dosing and so far no sign of algae. The tank is up and running around 2 months now just recently I am seeing these deficiency signs.

I am very hesitant to add anymore ca and mg to the tank at this point. Could there be anything else that I am missing out?

Zapins

What plants are you seeing deficiency on and can you post a picture of them?

It might not be deficiency, there is a slim chance that the problem is too much of a nutrient. But we need pictures and details.