glutaraldehyde instead of excel - Page 4 - South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts (SWOAPE)

epicfish · 10-05-2006, 08:18 AM

After looking in the CRC handbook for possible polycyclo compounds, I'm guessing the side-chains in the polycycloglutaracetal (active compound) of Excel seems to make it less toxic. Not sure if the cyclo side chains actually allow for more carbon molecules per molecule of the polycyclo compound, but it makes the compound less toxic and/or prolongs the shelf-life.

dennis · 10-05-2006, 08:32 AM

Epicfish, nice find there. I really am no good at internet searches.

Their boilogical grade looks more economical at 450ml 25% for $15. The equals 4.5 liters at 2.5% dilution. Since the other gluteraldehyde they ofer is pure for EM fixative, I would imagine that the steralization stuff marketed for hospitals/doctors is biological grade. Maybe not though.

With shipping, probably 6-8 buck your talking about $5 a liter. 'Course, for $1.50 more you can get 450ml of 50% solution, or 9 liters of 2.5%, or $2.66 a liter. Excel is $38 plus shipping for 4 liters. IF you want smaller amounts of Excel, it is way more expensive....$7.50 for 500ml plus shipping.

dennis · 10-05-2006, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by epicfish

After looking in the CRC handbook for possible polycyclo compounds, I'm guessing the side-chains in the polycycloglutaracetal (active compound) of Excel seems to make it less toxic. Not sure if the cyclo side chains actually allow for more carbon molecules per molecule of the polycyclo compound, but it makes the compound less toxic and/or prolongs the shelf-life.

OCHCH2CH2CH2CHO
I would think so, logically. It would seem that activation would kick off an H or OH, possibly then forming longer chains through a C=C double bond. This should make it more stable and less toxic, plus more alkaline?

Yes, no?

allen · 10-05-2006, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MatPat

I think I have some mini Riccia still, I will check and let you know later on. Do you want me to mail it to you or wait until the Auction?

When is the auction?The weekend of the 14th is the only time I can't make it.If it is that weekend maybe you could mail it to me.LMK.

chiahead · 10-05-2006, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by epicfish

Google cache. I can't find the original thread. Or rather, haven't looked for it.

PlantedFanatics.com :: View topic - Effects of Seachem Flourish Excel on BBA

Conclusion

The effects of Seachem Flourish Excel on BBA were documented with images and texts. It shows that Seachem Flourish Excel caused the BBA to turned red within 24 hours. The BBA gradually turned white over 120 Hours and disintegrate slowly thereafter.The experiment shows that Seachem Flourish Excel has successfully eliminated BBA. We would advise that Seachem Flourish Excel should not be use as a permanent way of removing BBA, as solving the root of the problem is the key to prevent future outbreak. We realised that Flourish Excel should not be used in large amount on mosses, riccia, and fissidens. It may cause them to turn brown or even kill them.

So MatPat, high doses of Excel *will* kill riccia. =)

I concur and have done this personally. It will even kill shrimp and snails if dosed too high for too long.

MrSanders · 10-05-2006, 07:45 PM

hey allen, I have a TON of riccia growing wild in a little tub that i used to have daphina in.... i would be more than willing to donate a big protion for you to expierment with on this one, for the price of shipping, or I will just send it regular mail for free if you think it will make it. Send me a PM if your intrested

dennis · 10-06-2006, 01:36 PM

If anyone cares, an update... I ordered the 450ml of 25% biological grade gluteraldehyde from the link epicfish posted. The company is Electron Microscopy Sciences. Order took about 5 minutes and they were very friendly. Order ships Monday so I will update whenI get it and the final price with shipping.

spcyamada · 10-07-2006, 01:00 AM

I've subscribed to this thread. If this does indeed turn out to be an alternative to Excel, that would be great. Please post results!

allen · 10-08-2006, 08:30 AM

Update

When I first started with the glutaraldehyde it seemed to kill all the riccia.But I just found a few small 1/2" pieces in the 10g.
MrSanders,thanks for the offer.

Also the bolbitis has grown 1" or 2 and the leaves are wider.this plant has done nothing in the last 6-8months.

Gomer · 10-08-2006, 12:20 PM

time to find out exactly what is in Excel. I have a big bottle of it and when I get free time, I'll have to do LC-MS, organic phase GC-MS and maybe even ESI-MS.