Pump for sump tank - Equipment - Aquatic Plant Central

Go Back   Aquatic Plant Central > General Interest Forums > Equipment

Equipment Aquarium Equipment - Discuss equipment to help setup your planted aquarium.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-08-2014, 06:12 AM   #1 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
cavamaroz28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 19
iTrader Ratings: 0
cavamaroz28 is a regular member
Default Pump for sump tank

Iv got a canister filter (with no filters) running as a pump from my lower sump tank to a uv turbo twist then up to the 75g tank. It does the job but it seems like it struggles. It takes a little while to get it goin again after i shut it off and some times itl stop pumping water and gargle on air rarely. Im going to be adding a diy inline co2 reactor soon and i feel like thats gona add more stress for the canister. I want to switch out the canister for a regular pump but idk what would be a good strong pump and what gph would be appropriate to handle the load.
cavamaroz28 is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisement [Remove Advertisement]
Old 09-08-2014, 07:46 AM   #2 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Tugg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: McKinney, TX (Dallas/DFW)
Posts: 870
iTrader Ratings: 0
Tugg is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank

I was thinking of doing something similar, but a friend warned me it was a bad idea for the reasons you listed.

Doing some research, it seems the problem is that the pump is having to suck water from the sump, and then push it up to the display. This rapid low to high pressure can cause cavitation. This is the process of the water effectively vaporizing into microbubbles that then rapidly collapse. This cause all sorts of weird problems from ultrasonic vibrations and localized extreme heat. In any case, it basically trashes your pump.

Many canisters, like Eheims, have the pump on top of the canister. These are designed to be below the intake not next to it (since your intake is in the sump). This setup can cause them to run dry if you power off. The return line will drain down to the sump's water level. If the the section of the sump you draw water from is below the pump, then your pump and some filter media will be sitting dry and unless it's self priming, will fail to restart (and will burn up).

There is also the problem of the return lines head pressure. Many canisters have pumps more equipped to be circulation powerheads, than real pumps. The return's highest point is typically only an inch or two above the tanks waterline, and requires very little pressure to push it over (<0.1psi). As a sump return pump, it's pushing past about 4ft of head pressure (1.73psi). That's a LOT more work.

When I set mine up, I'm going to try a few things to mitigate these problems. For one, I'll be using an Eheim 2262. They have a 1262 pump on them that are designed for head pressure. I'll also have my canister feed a tall Rexx Grigg CO2 reactor. This will cause a large loop to follow after the pump so when the pump is powered off, the return can't drain past the pump. The water level on the reactors output will match the level in the sump, and the pump will stay wet inside of a syphon between the sump and reactor. I'm also going to install 2 check valves in series after the CO2 reactor. This should help prevent the water from draining down in the first place. I'm also hoping that with this loop, the pump will run effectively as if submerged since being in a constant syphon, it doesn't have to do the work of pulling water up over the sumps wall, it's effectively just pushing water up from the reactor. It's a minor difference, but if cavitation is a problem, this may help with it.

Basically, the CO2 reactor you're looking to add, may actually help you if the base of it is below the sumps waterline.
Tugg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2014, 05:08 PM   #3 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Slownas1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
iTrader Ratings: 0
Slownas1 is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank

I am currently in the process of building my own sump and have been researching these very questions. What kind of pump and how many gph?

So the gph needs to match your overflow. I have an over flow box of 1500gph. (To be honest it isn't so much the box as what size pipe you have feeding your sump.). There is a chart I found with a quick gloogle search of what diameter pipe has what gph flow.

http://flexpvc.com/WaterFlowBasedOnPipeSize.shtml

Once you know that you just match your pumps flow to that. One thing you need to know when looking for a pump is that they have different flow rates depending on how high they are pumping the water. (So if your pump is sitting under your tank you need to measure the distance from the output of the pump to the return output to the tank.). Example is my pump will sit below my tank and it will pump up to a spray bar 4.5 feet away.

The pump will have a chart on the side of the box that shows you gph at different heights.

The one I'm looking at is a jebao it has a variable speed which will allow me to dial in the flow to what I want. It is also a dc pump so the power converter is external from the pump and with this being a submersible pump it will cut down on added heat to the tank.

http://www.fish-street.com/jebao_dc_...ery_new_jersey

At the bottom of this website it has a chart. It is in meters and liters which is bit of a pain but some simple converting and you get it in good old fashion gallons and feet.

Hope this helps.
Slownas1 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 09-08-2014, 05:16 PM   #4 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
cavamaroz28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 19
iTrader Ratings: 0
cavamaroz28 is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank

I really appreciate the info guys ima post a pic of what i got now. Its not pretty at all.. kinda just thrown together lol
cavamaroz28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2014, 05:20 PM   #5 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
cavamaroz28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 19
iTrader Ratings: 0
cavamaroz28 is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank

last pic is of where it comes in
cavamaroz28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2014, 03:51 AM   #6 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
cavamaroz28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 19
iTrader Ratings: 0
cavamaroz28 is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank


This is what i was thinking originally.
cavamaroz28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2014, 02:45 PM   #7 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Slownas1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 7
iTrader Ratings: 0
Slownas1 is a regular member
Default Re: Pump for sump tank

The flow design seems solid to me.
Slownas1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Aquatic Plant Central > General Interest Forums > Equipment > Pump for sump tank

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:52 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1