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MiamiAG 01-23-2004 07:19 AM

If you could do it over again...
I think it would be valuable for newbies to learn from the mistakes of more experienced aquatic gardeners. Lets learn from our mistakes.

If you could do it over again, what would you do differently?

I'll start it out...

I would plant more densely from the very beginning and do water changes more often.

Phil Edwards 01-23-2004 12:31 PM

I would forgo the CO2 and commercial substrates and concentrate solely on Walstead style tanks.

Planting heavily from the start is a close second.

bobo 01-23-2004 07:06 PM

I think I'd start out with sterilized plants and sterilized everything, i.e. bleach treat the works. In fact, I'm doing this massive program now, three to five years into some tanks. Somewhere along the line I introduced a particularly nasty from of red algae, which I believe is a form of staghorn and also a very thick, green, choking type of hair algae which I think is claph. or oodeo-whatever.

Now, I am not talking here about the soft, brown and green snot algae which comes along with almost every body of water one initiates as an aquatic zone. Those minor annoyances come floating in on airborn spores and then go away with proper nutrient management and the standard plant tank protocols. No, I'm talking about some real serious pests here which I've probably imported from all over the wide, wide world with my many aquatic plant trades. These red algae do not float through the air and are passed on only through direct water to water contact. The only treatment for any type of these Red, pest algae one has as far as I'm concerned is to bleach absolutly everything and quarentine anything, and I mean anything new from then on -- plant, fish, even rocks and wood.

I personally intend to do as Paul Kromholz suggests and closely examine each new plant in a white dishpan under good lighting with a big magnifying glass. Depending on what I discover, the plant may get just a mild, 2 minute safety treatment in a 19 to 1 mix of 5% bleach and water, or as much as five to seven minutes for some anubias and narrow leaf Java fern I know that look as if they might be related to ZZ Top.

Some find this sort of philosophy a bit extreme, but I'll bet in reality they just haven't run into one of these monsters (yet). I've heard some people claim that these algaes evolved in the Asian plant nurseries to take advantage of the exact same conditions many of us like to provide our plants with - high light, high nutrient levels and CO2. If you really have one of these beasts you can try to nutrient manage the situation all you want. I have and it aint happening.

As a matter of fact, I've personally gotten to the point with my aquatic chemistry skills where I can dial in whatever proportion of nutrients (or lack of nuttrients) anyone would care to suggest as a management strategy, and have in fact done so in many extended instances to no avail. Hey, once you have the proper (good) test kits and have determined the nutrient consumption rates on each of your tanks through their use in conjunction with the nutrient calculator -- it's just not that mysterious or hard to do. Algae's still there anyway.

I don't want it managed into the background -- I want it gone forever


panaque 01-24-2004 02:33 AM

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe that red algae is an aerobic algae, meaning that it does just the opposite of normal plants in respect to respiration. I do know that it seems to go away if you maintain co2 levels at around 30ppm. I believe that at this level plants will start to really outcompete it for nutrients. It also might "suffocate" it. Higher than 30 ppm though and your fish will start to have problems. And be sure to keep an eye on your pH.
For me, what I would do differently is to get a bigger aquarium. But then I would just want the next size up. Maybe I should have been born with gills! :lol:

MiamiAG 01-26-2004 04:09 AM

Oh, I thought of another one.

Introduce an algae clean up crew early on. Plenty of SAEs, ottos and shrimp.

bobo 01-26-2004 04:55 AM

If we could start over
Pan. As I understand it, Red algaes are mostly marine, having evolved in that environment. There are fresh water types too though, like staghorn, bba, brush algae, too if I'm not mistaken. They only show red with alcohol prep.

Excuse the use of common names, which we usually have a fit over when refering to (higher) plants, but the Latin for these algae is seldom seen for some reason. Perhaps this is because no one is really sure of applying the correct taxonomy in the appropriate places. I'm certainly not.

This point about the CO2 may be the key because, now that I think of it, the staghorn's re-appearance after a long nap was concurrent with my running out of CO2 and not replacing the tank for about a month. As I recall, I was busy and also curious to see the effects without it. Guess I have my curiousity satisfied now!

Bob Olesen

MiamiAG 02-01-2004 03:38 AM

THought of another one...I wouldn't buy anything until I've researched them on a forum like APC. :D

Gomer 02-02-2004 08:51 PM

if I was to do it all over 29g would start as a planted tank from the start!. ..instead of converting it over from a fish only tank :D

shannon 02-02-2004 10:04 PM

starting over
After numerous "kills" by trial and error, I agree that research of the desired plants is at the top. Three things I now look for are what kind of water (soft-acid or tolerates harder), how much light and nutrient demands.

By the way friends; what is a Walstead style tank? :oops:


Sir_BlackhOle 02-03-2004 06:50 AM

"Walstad" style is based on Diana Walstads style of keeping planted aquariums. You need to get her book "Ecology of the Planted Aquarium." I am reading it right now and it was recommended to me by another plant enthusiast. It is a really good and informative book with lots and lots of details :-)

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