glutaraldehyde instead of excel - Page 7 - South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts - Aquatic Plant Central

Go Back   Aquatic Plant Central > Local or Regional Clubs - (Click button on right to expand) > South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts

South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts A forum for the South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts club.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-08-2006, 08:24 PM   #61 (permalink)
The Plant Whisperer
 
Zapins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Harrogate, TN
Posts: 6,404
iTrader Ratings: 66
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
Zapins is a valuable member of the community Zapins is a valuable member of the community
Default

Soo.... Excel is just modified to make it less toxic?

Has it been modified in any way to make it more effective at giving CO2 to plants than glutaraldehyde?

Also, does anyone know if Excel is pure? Or is it laced w/ other chemicals?

I was thinking about running some lab tests on it to see how it is put together in the hopes of gaining an idea of how to make it, but I need a pure sample in order to run the tests.
Zapins is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisement [Remove Advertisement]
Old 11-13-2006, 04:52 PM   #62 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 137
iTrader Ratings: 9
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
jude_uc is a regular member
Default

Dennis and others who are experimenting? How often are you adding your mixture? Have you noticed any problems? Are the shrimp doing fine with levels you're dosing? Thanks!

-Adam
jude_uc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2006, 05:27 PM   #63 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
dennis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Leverett, Mass
Posts: 2,988
iTrader Ratings: 47
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
dennis is a regular member
Default

I am adding 10ml of 2.5% solution to a 29 gallon aquarium every day. If I am doing the math correct, and I am pretty sure of it now, that equals 2.5mg/l added daily. I have Amano shrimp, nerite snails and dwarf cories- all seem fine. In the past, overdosing Excel generally killed Amanos and Nerites so I take that as an Ok sign. The long term effects of this on the fauna is unknown though and I am beginning to wonder how I am affecting them in the end.

Algae is definately receeding. Concentrations that I have described are only detrimental to the algae with direct application though I am noticing that no more algae is returning and CO2 levels have remained the same. However, I increased the dosing of every other nutrient so that may play a part also.
dennis is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 11-18-2006, 12:59 AM   #64 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 1,550
iTrader Ratings: 68
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
epicfish is a regular member
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapins View Post
Soo.... Excel is just modified to make it less toxic?

Has it been modified in any way to make it more effective at giving CO2 to plants than glutaraldehyde?

Also, does anyone know if Excel is pure? Or is it laced w/ other chemicals?

I was thinking about running some lab tests on it to see how it is put together in the hopes of gaining an idea of how to make it, but I need a pure sample in order to run the tests.
No, it's not pure, it's combined with "ameliorating" chemicals.

You can try to distill it and then run GC-MS or whatever you want on the separate fractions that are collected.
epicfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2006, 07:26 AM   #65 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 178
iTrader Ratings: 0
AndyT. is a regular member
Default

Okay, I don't think I'm dumb, but I got lost...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gomer View Post
time to find out exactly what is in Excel. I have a big bottle of it and when I get free time, I'll have to do LC-MS, organic phase GC-MS and maybe even ESI-MS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by epicfish View Post
Tony, I'd be interested in helping you figure out what's in it. I might grab a bottle sometime and run GC-FTIR-MS on it...unless you beat me to it. =P
Quote:
Originally Posted by epicfish View Post
You can try to distill it and then run GC-MS or whatever you want on the separate fractions that are collected.
Here is what I think you guys are talking about:
MS is Mass Spectrometry, not Multiple Sclerosis.

All the others, LC, GC, ESI are different methods of performing mass spectrometry?

Now I know that all of you are referring to possibly using equipment you have access to to perform this analysis, so the answer to my next question may be simply that you don't have access to this type of equipment but:

Wouldn't ion chromatography be better for determining what precisely is in Excel and the proportions in which it occurs? I'm aware that it is much more complex than simply tossing some Excel in the IC and waiting for it to spit out an analysis, but I thought that was what IC specialized in doing.
AndyT. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2006, 08:01 AM   #66 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 1,550
iTrader Ratings: 68
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
epicfish is a regular member
Default

I hadn't given any consideration to the ameliorating chemicals. Without a pure sample of the main ingredient of Excel, any of these methods would give spectrums that would be impossible to figure out.

IC would work to see the functional groups and they're relative abundancies, you're right. MS would give common m/z groups which will lead to a better understanding of the actual structure of the compound. NMR would give even more information about the proximities of the carbons and functional groups to each other.

Even if we did manage to get "pure" Excel, figuring out the structure wouldn't be such a simple task given our limited resources to this equipment.
epicfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-18-2006, 08:08 PM   #67 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
gnatster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 2,491
iTrader Ratings: 10
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
gnatster is a regular member
Default

Need to remind you folks this stuff can be dangerous to play around with. Use at your own risk.
gnatster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-2006, 09:09 AM   #68 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 83
iTrader Ratings: 1
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
allen is a regular member
Default

Hi everyone

I haven't posted anything here for awhlie because I've been playing around with the glut.

I've been adjusting the doses and found that 1ml to 1 gallon of water at a water change does not seem to hurt the fish,plants or bio filter along with a 1:2 daily dose.This will slowly kill the algae.
For a more severe algae problem I can add 1:1 three days after the 1:1 at water change.
A 1:1 daily dose seems to stress the fish.Plants are fine but it will destroy the bio along with the algae.
A 1.5:1 will kill the fish.
Once the algae is gone I reduced it to 1:5.The plants are growing as fast as they are in the tank with co2.
This is what has happened in my tanks and it might be different for your setup.

I haven't tried a dip for new plants yet but it might be a way to kill the algae and those #%@* snails & eggs before placing them in the tank.
Eric,I should've tried this with that red rubin I got from you.Oh well,the loaches are happy,their bellies are full.

Has anyone else tried this stuff?What kind of effects has it had on your plants?I'm sure others would like to here about it.

As with all chemicals please use with caution and if you do a search it's easy to find the MSDS for glutaraldehyde.
allen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-31-2006, 10:46 AM   #69 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
MatPat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Dayton, Ohio
Posts: 3,819
iTrader Ratings: 34
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
MatPat is a valuable member of the community MatPat is a valuable member of the community
Default

Thanks for the update Allen!
MatPat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2007, 08:45 PM   #70 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,194
iTrader Ratings: 48
iTrader Positive Rating: 100%
chiahead is a regular member
Default

What I would really like to know is how to buy some of this stuff.
chiahead is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Aquatic Plant Central > Local or Regional Clubs - (Click button on right to expand) > South Western Ohio Aquatic Plant Enthusiasts > glutaraldehyde instead of excel

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 05:51 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1