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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello. Please help me understand the problem.
The aquarium is a little less than a year old, homemade fertilizers, light Chihiros vivid 2, 9 hours a day with sunrise and sunset, ADA Amazonia 2 soil, osmosis water with remineralizer Ca / Mg = 3.2 / 1.

Water parameters - PH-6.4-6.8; KH-3; GH-4.5-5, PO4-0 ppm; NH3-NH4-NO2-0 ppm; NO3-5-10 ppm.

There are problems with blyxa japonica, utricularia graminifolia, staurogyne repens, pogostemon helferi, cyperus helferi and other species. These plants simply do not want to grow, they shrink, the lower leaves are destroyed and covered with BBA, GSA. I see brown roots in cyperus helferi. Problems began after the launch on ADA Amazonia 2, before that there was JBL Manado soil, there were no such problems with it.

I am adding the following number of items per week with a 2hr aquarist apt complete recipe:
NO3 - 7-10 ppm (KNO3 + Urea)
PO4 - 2.45 ppm (KH2PO4)
K - 12 ppm (KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4)
Fe - 0.2 ppm (DTPA + Gluconate)
The micro elements are formulated according to the Tropica recipe.

My brain went through all the possible options for the causes of problems, but I cannot figure out what they don't like ...

Plant Green Vertebrate Natural environment Natural landscape
 

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Very strange. All your other plants look great. The plants you’re having trouble with are easy to grow. Can your circle the plants in the picture? It could be a flow issue where they’re not getting CO2.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
Very strange. All your other plants look great. The plants you’re having trouble with are easy to grow. Can your circle the plants in the picture? It could be a flow issue where they’re not getting CO2.
Plant Terrestrial plant Grass Groundcover Flowering plant


pogostemon helferi - or rather what is left of it ... I'm afraid I will lose this plant

Plant Flower Terrestrial plant Leaf vegetable Groundcover


Bucephalandra suffers from BBA

Plant Leaf vegetable Terrestrial plant Groundcover Grass


hygrophila corymbosa kompakt - lower leaves fall, young leaves are not of the correct shape, shriveled, crooked

Plant Botany Terrestrial plant Natural landscape Grass


blyxa japonica - there is a small bush, there is practically no growth, it looks weak

Plant Leaf Botany Natural environment Terrestrial plant


riccardia chamedryfolia - no growth, BBA, overgrown with other mosses, destroyed

Plant Green Leaf Terrestrial plant Grass


staurogyne repens - lower leaves collapse, shrinks, poor growth

I feed CO2 up to a yellow-green drop checker (about 30 ppm). The flow from the filter is good, the atomizer produces dust from bubbles, which is carried throughout the entire volume of the tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I have suspicions about plant intoxication with metals, but there is no evidence of this. Tests for Fe and Cu do not give increased readings, Cu - 0, Fe - 0.1-0.3 ppm
 

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The Bucephalandra and moss are slow growers so algae grow on them easily. You might have too much light for the amount of nutrients and CO2 available. Try lowering the PAR of the light by lifting up the light by a foot/30cm, or reduce the duration to 7 hours, or both.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The Bucephalandra and moss are slow growers so algae grow on them easily. You might have too much light for the amount of nutrients and CO2 available. Try lowering the PAR of the light by lifting up the light by a foot/30cm, or reduce the duration to 7 hours, or both.
Thanks. Yes, I also thought about light and have already reduced it. Initially the luminaire operated at 84W and produced 27,000 lux on the surface of the water under the light, a few months ago I reduced it to 64W and got 20,700 lux on the surface. Suspension height 23 cm. It may be worth lowering or increasing the height. But in this case, what about ADA luminaires, which do not have power control, and the suspension height is on average 30 cm? According to ADA data - Approx. 21,000Lx (Central illuminance at 30cm distance).

I also have a suspicion of a lack of CO2. But it certainly cannot be a lack of nutrition. Compared to the ADA system, they have no phosphorus dosage at all, and nitrogen is more of a supplement than a systemic supplement. The same situation is with trace elements.

I have a big question for the ADA system regarding phosphorus. The soil of Amazonia 2 absorbs any amount of phosphate in a matter of hours, if root plants have access to the substrate and, accordingly, phosphate, then how the epiphytes receive phosphate remains a mystery to me. In addition, the amount of nitrogen in Amazonia 2 also surprised me not for the better, it is not enough, I expected more. Unfortunately, there is no way to buy a classic amazon in Russia at the moment, but I think it gives more interesting results.
 

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I have a trick of dosing a small amount of macro and micronutrients every day, 3-4 hours after the lights turn on. It seems to work better than once a week or once a few days.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
I do exactly that, small doses every day. At the end of the week, 40-50% of water changes. TDS after the substitution 120, at the end of the week about 160.
 

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Any reason why you're using osmosis water? Sometimes regular water is best. Plants need quite a bit of calcium. I would say 10-15ppm.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Any reason why you're using osmosis water? Sometimes regular water is best. Plants need quite a bit of calcium. I would say 10-15ppm.
in our city, the quality of tap water is very low, there are cases when the water from the tap is similar in color to coca cola)) There is a lot of rust in the water. And hardness parameters KH 16, GH 28. Without osmosis, I cannot create a tank with plants. My experiments with the amount of calcium showed a calcium-potassium relationship. If the content of potassium is higher than calcium, then radiculitis of young leaves was manifested.

based on the dosage of potassium, I remineralize osmosis with a little more calcium in relation to potassium
 

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You mean a little more Calcium in relation to Magnesium. Right? I'm not trying to be a wise guy. I get the impression you are a more skilled aquarist than I am notwithstanding this current problem you are having.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
You mean a little more Calcium in relation to Magnesium. Right? I'm not trying to be a wise guy. I get the impression you are a more skilled aquarist than I am notwithstanding this current problem you are having.
I didn’t want to sound smart either, my experience of about 10 years does not give me an answer to my problem. just trying to describe the problem in detail and give a lot of data to understand the situation. about Ca / Mg - no, I was talking about the K / Ca ratio.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
You mean a little more Calcium in relation to Magnesium. Right? I'm not trying to be a wise guy. I get the impression you are a more skilled aquarist than I am notwithstanding this current problem you are having.
By the way, ADA produces two potassium supplement products. Brighty K and Brighty neutral K. They describe the use of these products in relation to the hardness of the water used. Brighty K for soft water and Brighty neutral K for harder water. If we proceed from the fact that this is done precisely taking into account the amount of calcium at different water hardness, then this decision becomes clear. Brighty neutral K uses KCl, which does not affect the buffering capacity and PH of water, while Brighty K uses K2CO3, which is a buffer and slightly raises PH. In addition, the concentration (ppm / l) of potassium in these products differs by almost two times. Brighty K - 2.6% and Brighty neutral K - 5%. That is, we see that almost half the amount of potassium is introduced for soft water.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
You mean a little more Calcium in relation to Magnesium. Right? I'm not trying to be a wise guy. I get the impression you are a more skilled aquarist than I am notwithstanding this current problem you are having.
But I am not claiming that my observations and assumptions are true. For example Seachem Equilibrium contains a lot of potassium in relation to calcium, but I don't think Seachem did it by mistake, I really like their products.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
My main question is that all nutrient parameters are in good values, good light, good filtration, CO2 supply, nutrient soil, regular water changes. But in the end I have dying plants ... It haunts me, I do not understand.
 

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My main question is that all nutrient parameters are in good values, good light, good filtration, CO2 supply, nutrient soil, regular water changes. But in the end I have dying plants ... It haunts me, I do not understand.
It really is haunting. I'm obsessed with water parameters and everything looks right to me. Do you really have to live with 0 ppm PO4 in the water column because of that substrate? That would frustrate me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
It really is haunting. I'm obsessed with water parameters and everything looks right to me. Do you really have to live with 0 ppm PO4 in the water column because of that substrate? That would frustrate me.
you are absolutely right. that's why I don't understand how the ADA system works without phosphorus. The ADA says the phosphorus comes from fish feeding and fish waste. But it doesn't work for me. Too little phosphorus. From this, the GSA immediately appears. So I decided to use the Dennis method. Zero concentration of phosphates in the tank water may not be a problem; at a dosage of 2.4 ppm per week, this indicates that the plants have absorbed some of the phosphates and are partially bound by the soil and filter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
It really is haunting. I'm obsessed with water parameters and everything looks right to me. Do you really have to live with 0 ppm PO4 in the water column because of that substrate? That would frustrate me.
But I also have questions about Dennis' method. Its nitrate to phosphate ratio is completely out of sync with Redfield's. It's very interesting why.
 

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But I also have questions about Dennis' method. Its nitrate to phosphate ratio is completely out of sync with Redfield's. It's very interesting why.
Would you please explain some of the ratios to us? I know the one about Calcium to Magnesium. Calcium to Potassium I have not seen before. It's my understanding that ratios somehow synergize nutrient uptake. How do you manage these ratios in a dynamic changing system? Don't they interfere with each other? Do you think one of them could be causing your problem?
But I am not claiming that my observations and assumptions are true. For example Seachem Equilibrium contains a lot of potassium in relation to calcium, but I don't think Seachem did it by mistake, I really like their products.
Yes, I think there is a method to their madness. I don't know what it is though. Equilibrium is good for low-tech. You don't have to worry about underdosing the Potassium like I occassionally do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Would you please explain some of the ratios to us? I know the one about Calcium to Magnesium. Calcium to Potassium I have not seen before. It's my understanding that ratios somehow synergize nutrient uptake. How do you manage these ratios in a dynamic changing system? Don't they interfere with each other? Do you think one of them could be causing your problem?

Yes, I think there is a method to their madness. I don't know what it is though. Equilibrium is good for low-tech. You don't have to worry about underdosing the Potassium like I occassionally do.
Long ago I noticed that when using high doses of potassium (about 30 ppm or more per week) with a total hardness of GH 4-5, many long-stemmed plants show signs of radiculitis of new shoots. At first I thought it was calcium or boron, but later I read articles about impaired absorption of calcium with increased doses of potassium. The best known antagonism occurs between potassium and sodium, and therefore higher doses of potassium are used for hard water (this is not always the case, hard water may not contain much sodium), but the calcium-potassium ratio has also been found to be present. As the author of the article argued, the concentration of potassium must necessarily be less than the concentration of calcium. Yes, you are absolutely correct that it is impossible to maintain precise concentrations in a dynamically changing system, but this works in the long run. I confirm this from my own experience. With a decrease in the weekly dose of potassium to 8-15 ppm, the signs of sciatica completely disappeared.

As for Seachem Equilibrium - is osmosis with a remineralizer used in non-technological tanks? I can understand if the poor quality of the water (like mine) does not allow the use of the water supply. I think low-tech tanks are made with tap water.

I hope I understood your question correctly, if not, please describe in more detail.
 
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