[HeyPK]

By hair algae, I mean any of the filamentous algae that are tough and are not eaten by snails such as ramshorns, pond snails, or Malaysian trumpet snails. Cladophora is included in my definition, along with the ones that are called fuzz algae, such as Oedogonium. Also included are black beard algae and staghorn algae. The only types of algae I have in my tanks are the soft attached types, which can be managed by snails and green water, which can be managed by, if you have fish, having a sufficient density of plants and, if you don't have fish, by introducing Daphnia.

 

[Tex Gal]

I think one of the issues that impacts algae and it's battles are the types of plants you are growing. If you have the more difficult high light ones that require high tech everything algae will be more of a problem to get a handle on. Many of those that don't have algae issues aren't growing these plants. (I'm not saying that is everyone - so don't get upset if this doesn't pertain to you.) It's just a lot harder because there is NO ROOM for error. Things grow fast, consume fast, get messy fast. I have mostly rare and difficult plants. I got bba just from a weekend at the AGA conference when the tank was overfed. It's disappear fast now. But it was a mess!

If this were child's play there would not be so much talk about algae and the control of algae.

 

[Manwithnofish]

If this were child's play there would not be so much talk about algae and the control of algae.

That was my point. It isn't as easy or simple as was implied. There is a lot of experience on this forum and thus far no one has been able to tell me how to solve the problem. It's like trying to balance an egg on a toothpick. God only knows how some people did it, but you can't just tell someone how to do it. Hell, I've not even figured out how to make the toothpick stand up, let alone put an egg on top. I think it's just far too much science for us to comprehend. In fact, I believe I am very near of the opinion that it simply isn't possible. Or perhaps I should say, simply isn't worth it. :croc:

 

[BryceM]

Manwithnoalgae,

Most people who have messed around with algae problems are closer to success than they realize. There isn't a single formula for success but there are a few simple principles and if you'll follow them, I can almost guarantee success. Send me a PM.

 

[Cavan Allen]

I am not in favor of this method. Whether or not it works isn't the issue for me, it's the band-aid part I don't care for. We all search for a quick fix, but nothing trumps sheer knowledge and execution of proper methods that have been tried and true.

Thank you. That's been my view as well. I don't mean to pick on Hoppy or anyone else in this thread or overlook the fact that many newer people have problems. The point is that based on my experience, things like this are a diversion and should not be relied upon for success. Knowledge and application of the fundamentals is.

 

[Tex Gal]

I really think the point here is that everyone "wants" a balanced tank. No one "wants" to fool around with algae. Sometimes life happens and you get algae. SO now what? You have to clean and scrub and take action. It doesn't just melt away for most people. Clado keeps growing unless you get it all out. BBA damages leaf tissue and you need to prune. Until you get the system balanced you still have to deal with the stuff.

I lost a great field of UG because of clado that I brought in from an LFS. I didn't even buy plant from them! I bought fish. I don't even put the fish water in the tank. I must have scooped out a minute particle with the fish. When I changed my light bulbs trying to find the proper amount of light I had clado! I did get rid of it. Haven't seen it back since, (knock on wood).

Some of us just need a little extra help from time to time. It's not a "regular" thing. It's like a gravel vacuum sometimes!

 

[Manwithnofish]

Clado keeps growing unless you get it all out. BBA damages leaf tissue and you need to prune. Until you get the system balanced you still have to deal with the stuff.

I lost a great field of UG because of clado that I brought in from an LFS. I didn't even buy plant from them! I bought fish. I don't even put the fish water in the tank. I must have scooped out a minute particle with the fish. When I changed my light bulbs trying to find the proper amount of light I had clado! I did get rid of it. Haven't seen it back since, (knock on wood).

If that's the case, I'd have to empty the tank, throw all the substrate away, throw out all the plants, clean everything and start over, except this time wear a clean suit whenever I feed my fish! I don't think I want to go through that.

So what are my alternatives. Get rid of the CO2, ferts, and half the light. If I give up the plants, would I be able to keep fish without fighting alage and cleaning everything every week?

 

[helgymatt]

Thank you. That's been my view as well. I don't mean to pick on Hoppy or anyone else in this thread or overlook the fact that many newer people have problems. The point is that based on my experience, things like this are a diversion and should not be relied upon for success. Knowledge and application of the fundamentals is.

Did anyone say that is algae TREATMENT should be "relied upon for success"? The way I see it, as TexGal and others have stressed, that algae DOES and WILL happen even in the best managed tanks. Now, for beginners especially, algae is more likely to occur because they are still learning! You cannot simply grasp everything about planted aquariums overnight. People get into this hobby thinking that growing aquatic plants shouldn't be that hard....all of us were probably once there. Next thing we know, we have algae. I had algae....for some types of algae you need a way to treat it, and then need a way to prevent it from coming back. We learn from our mistakes and we begin to have less and less algae problems as time goes on. I don't have algae in my tanks now, because of all I have learned.

If some nasty algae returns, like Clado, what do it do? It is not just as simple as "getting things right" and it will just go away quickly. For some algae, yes, correcting things will help them go away, but other types of algae will not go away for a long time. Who has that kind of patience? I have had to tear up foregrounds of glosso and HC because of this S&$t that I spend months maturing. Nothing would kill it and manually removing it was next to impossible. If this method turns out to be a treatment for this type of algae, then what is the problem? If I dont have to throw away months of growth and work, then I'm all for this! Keep up the work Hoppy (if its even worth mentioning him now) and TexGal! "Some" of us appreciate your effort in this and ingenuity to answer some unknown questions.

This is just like maintaining anything else....like your house, car, lawn mower....If you let things go, problems will occur and you need a "fix". Sure, the best thing to do is wash your car every day, paint your house every year, and change your oil every month, but we are not all perfect and forget to do things some times.

 

[Cavan Allen]

I had algae....I needed a way to treat it, and then needed a way to prevent it from coming back.

The problem is that there is often a focus on treatment rather than prevention. That's the point I and a few other have been trying to make here. Getting rid of what you've already got is one thing, but what you need to do to get rid of it without fancy chemicals and prevent it from coming back are the same thing. And I'd like to point out again that stable, well maintained tanks are often largely resistant to outbreaks. You don't need to be constantly hovering over your tanks to keep them clean and running well.

P.S. Algae does not always happen even in well-run tanks. I had a 75 running for over a year and a half that didn't have even a single speck of algae from the first day to the last (when I let it go emersed). No joke. I've had other tanks that way and know other people who have tanks just like it. It's not as hard as a lot of people think.

 

[helgymatt]

The problem is that there is often a focus on treatment rather than prevention. That's the point I and a few other have been trying to make here. Getting rid of what you've already got is one thing, but what you need to do to get rid of it without fancy chemicals and prevent it from coming back are the same thing. And I'd like to point out again that stable, well maintained tanks are often largely resistant to outbreaks.

I completely agree that the focus should be on prevention and I have always stressed that to others.

But, can I ask what you do to beautiful stand of Glosso or HC infested with Clado, that you spend months creating? Or what you "would" do if you have never had that algae problem before? And you can't say that you won't have it because you do everything right to prevent it! Pretend you are a beginner and all was well until one weekend your CO2 ran out/your power went out/or you accidentally trippled your ferts, and this algae showed up and took over in a week

 

[Cavan Allen]

Give detailed tank specs and we'll see what we can do. Perhaps in another thread. Time for football.

 

[helgymatt]

Give detailed tank specs and we'll see what we can do. Perhaps in another thread. Time for football.

Thats a cop out. Sorry.

 

[Avalon]

There's two sides to the coin: prevention and a cure. To focus on the cure part, which seems to be the point at hand, I particularly liked the recent sticky thread about how to prune your planted tank. This is how you get rid of the algae you have.

I know all too well that accidents happen, you go out of town, or whatever the case may be, and algae shows up. I can't stress enough that you can't simply wave your magic wand and make the algae go away. You must prune it all off and let the plants regrow after having corrected the problem. If your tank is of the high light variety, they should grow back in a week or two. Look at it this way: you're going to have to prune, may as well do it a little early.

In the case of the foregrounds & clado, it's a tough one. You can always replant your foreground. It needs to be done on a regular basis anyway, along with a substrate vacuum underneath the old cover. It always grows in much faster than when you first started it since the plants are already acclimated to your tank. You'll learn quickly how to not get it after doing this once or twice. You want results, you gotta work for it.

 

[Cavan Allen]

This is a battle of some sort? That's news to me! It's all about keeping the thread on topic and not hijacking it. If you'd like to set up a help thread, have at it.

 

[helgymatt]

Cavan, I'm don't feel I'm hijacking this thread. I'm trying to backup the work that hoppy and tex are doing, while a few are trying to put it all down saying it is all worthless. This thread was hijacked long ago and drove hoppy away.

Avalon, I replanted my forground with my same glosso three times. Once you have clado in there, it will not go away. I removed as much as I could manually...didn't help. I tore it out and am leaving my forground empty till I confirm it is gone.

I don't need to start a new thread, I have solved the problem...unofortunatley I tore out the infected plants. Do you consider tearing out something you worked so hard to create a good way to get rid of algae?...I don't think so. Nothing else worked...I WISH I would have tried this method.

 

[Cavan Allen]

Cavan, I'm don't feel I'm hijacking this thread. I'm trying to backup the work that hoppy and tex are doing, while a few are trying to put it all down saying it is all worthless. This thread was hijacked long ago and drove hoppy away.

Avalon, I replanted my forground with my same glosso three times. Once you have clado in there, it will not go away. I removed as much as I could manually...didn't help. I tore it out and am leaving my forground empty till I confirm it is gone.

I don't need to start a new thread, I have solved the problem...unofortunatley I tore out the infected plants. Do you consider tearing out something you worked so hard to create a good way to get rid of algae?...I don't think so. Nothing else worked...I WISH I would have tried this method.

I give up. Good luck.