Here's my plan of action:

1. Just did a 40% WC /algae vacuum. Will continue w/ similar weekly WCs.
2. Added a Pleco. I was avoiding it, but he's already working the algae covering larger leaves.
3. Will add Mollies or Swordtails to eat some more algae.
4. Cut down feeding in half, so my fish eat more algae (angelfish, tetras, gouramis, rainbow shark) and to decrease ammonia production.
5. Improve the shading for my tank. It's getting too much sunlight.
6. Add more plants, and be patient.

Does this make sense? Any other sugestions / experiences?

Regards

 

Any other sugestions / experiences?

I went through the same thing. BBA, green hair algae, diatoms. It all started to die off as the substrate stopped pumping ferts into the water column, and the frogbit and duckweed got established. Floating plants compete directly with algae; they both pull their nutrition from the water so the more floating plants you have, the harder it is on algae. Unless you dose, eventually the tank water will get anemic in one or more essential nutrients and your algae will start to die.

Good luck!
Jim

 

Most of the algae you describe are growing due to a lack of ferts/CO2. If I were you I would keep water changes to a minimum as this removes valuable plant food. Also do not decrease feeding as this is an important source of plant food/CO2 etc unless there is loads of uneaten food accumulating. Manually remove as much of the algae as possible and prune back plant leaves/stems that are covered in algae - this will stimulate more plant growth.
Healthy plant growth suppresses algae and plants grow at their best when they have all the nutrients they need. The type of algae is usually an indication of what is lacking see below algae guide
http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/algae.htm

 

Most of the algae you describe are growing due to a lack of ferts/CO2.

Maybe I'm dense or something, but can you explain to me how this can be possible? If you add ferts and CO2 to the water, why isn't the algae going to take advantage of it for it's own growth along with the plants? How can this work in only the plant's favor and not that of algae? It just doesn't make any sense to me.

Jim

 

Thanks for the replies, and even more for the interesting discussion!

The way I see it, my tank must be definitely lacking CO2. its got enough nutrients, but more light than the plants can handle with the available CO2.
Good point made here about keeping up with fish feeding, I was thinking about it in the sense of NH3, but seeing it as a source of CO2 then it makes good sense (added the fact that I've constantly had 0 ammonia).

I've got KNO3 that I could fert, but without the CO2 I see very little point in supplementing my soil.... Excel would be nice, but for a 200 G I'd rather get press. CO2.

So from what I've understood, I'll keep regular feeding, improve the shading, and definitely add more plants.
Will add more Egeria densa... It it doesn't compete w/ algae then nothing will...

Thanks!
Each tank is its own experiment, and I'd rather work things out naturally than going all out with gadgets... So everyone's experiences are always welcome

 

I'm aware of the Fe in the water column theory and know that some experts say they believe it is the limiting factor in algae growth while others that say that it has no significant effect on limiting algae.
Below is a thread on the UKAPS forum where there is a good discussion on how plants may suppress algae (especially towards the end of the thread).

http://ukaps.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=6738

 

I'm sorry, that thread is three pages long and I'm supposed to do some work today. Can you copy/paste the relative text? Thanks!

Jim

 

From my experience, adding CO2 is just like hitting the accelerator pedal in a car. Everything happens the way it's supposed to happen, but just a lot faster. CO2 will make your plants grow fast but so will the algae. I think the correlation to the myth occurs when there is a finite amount of an essential nutrient. I don't think it necessarily has to be iron. If you don't increase ferts along with the increase in CO2, the essential ingredient for algae growth that's floating in the water will get exhausted sooner, leading one to believe that CO2 is bad for algae.

i think LIGHT is the accelerator pedal.

One thing i know for sure is that my tap water has lots of CO2 and probably phosphates. But i will test it tonight to see what theparameters are right now. I know it varies as well, and it has rained a lot lately, so its possible the hardness has decreased a bit.....

Only if you really have a deficit. Are your plants growing?

Actually, they are.
It's more noticeable in Egeria Densa, as it is easier to observe how much its grown... also, Hygrophylia Difformis is doing pretty good... my main problem with plants is that they are getting covered w/ algae. I do a vacuum like 3x a week to get rid of some from the plants and substrate. Even HC has not died (in about 2 weeks); i'm kinda surprised, i thought it was going to do worse.

Diana? Save me?

Yeah... save us

 

I came accross this read a few days ago:
http://koiclubsandiego.org/library/green_water.php

One bit that caught my attention:

When algae dies and is subjected to aerobic bacterial decomposition by heterotroph bacteria, a by-product of this process is a substance, released into the water, that is toxic to the living algae.

This theory is exactly the opposite of competition effects. Remember the myths based on Liebig's Law involve the removal or reduction of some factor, such as nutrients, or light, required by the bloom algae. This theory states that something is naturally ADDED to the water that kills the bloom algae. A similar example of this effect is penicillin, a substance that is released by one microorganism (a form of yeast), which is toxic to other microorganisms. The term for a substance released by one microorganism that is inhibitory to another microorganism is called an antibiotic and that name applies here as well.

From what i read, Green Water algae actually goes through a 'cycle' where a certain type of bacteria/enzyme develops within the system and eventually inhibits green water algae growth.

 

Picture

Here's a quick picture.
As you can see... there is not much to see

The plants are doing ok, actually improving day by day... right now it has 'decent' plant mass, although i'll put several more (as many as will physically fit). Pump is on the left side, filter output on the right, inlet about 2' L to R, at 18" depth.

There is still lots of work to do... on the tank/scape, the arrangement and the surroundings... more and better pics will come as things improve (hopefully!!)

Regards

 

Re: Picture

Here's a quick picture.
As you can see... there is not much to see

Yikes, that is some GREEN water. I've had slight cases of gw before but I could always see the back of the tank. They've cleared up on their own in about a week or so. And now that most of my setups have UV filters, green water is pretty much history.

If one of my tanks looked like yours, I would freak out and spring for an ultraviolet filter. Since installing mine, fish mortality has improved along with the water clarity, and they provide some water circulation. I would also fill up my canister filter with floss and check/rinse it once a day. The floss won't catch all of it, but eventually all that green is going to die and it has to land somewhere.

Good luck and keep us posted!
Jim

 

Flea, thanks for picture and information on your filters.

I know its tough to do, but I would just wait it out. Based on your first letter, its less than 3 weeks since you set it up.

You could try removing one or two of those filters. (The more water movement, the more CO2 loss.) However, in this situation, I think that getting floating plants to grow and just waiting it out will help the most.

GW (Green water) algae often crashes after a month or two, never to be seen again. [Perhaps over time, a virus or protozoa population builds up enough to kill the GW algae.] Once GW algae is gone, your plants should start growing well enough to compete with the other algae in your tank.

Folks, here's evidence that mineralizing soil ahead of time may not be worth the trouble. Except for my two experimental "Dry Start Method" tanks, I always set up tanks with soil and plants the same day.

 

Thanks for your helpful replies!

I know its tough to do, but I would just wait it out. Based on your first letter, its less than 3 weeks since you set it up.

Yes, the tank is pretty recent. I think i have no choice but to wait it out and plant some more floating plants. Once i can SEE the tank, i'll make the aquascape nicer.....

GW (Green water) algae often crashes after a month or two, never to be seen again. [Perhaps over time, a virus or protozoa population builds up enough to kill the GW algae.] Once GW algae is gone, your plants should start growing well enough to compete with the other algae in your tank.

Yes, i think so too. I posted a link above with a study that strongly suggests this... maybe you have some knowledge about it, but it sounds very interesting. The author suggests a bacteria (of the pseudomonas/aeromonas family) colonizes filter media (and soil) and gets rid of green water algae. Perhaps some soils/filter media already have lots of this bacteria, while others don't..... my canister filter was brand new when i installed it.

My tank had 0 ppm ammonia from day 1, and yet after about a week the water went absolutely green >> leads me to believe green water has more to do with something else (the bacteria above) and not necessarilly ammonia in the water column. Perhaps an outrageous ammonia spike or a drastic change in conditions in a settled aquarium kills this bacteria and GW comes back??

Folks, here's evidence that mineralizing soil ahead of time may not be worth the trouble. Except for my two experimental "Dry Start Method" tanks, I always set up tanks with soil and plants the same day.

Agree, i don't think its worth the hassle. Depending on your plants, the 'dry start' makes more sense as you are actually kick starting the PLANTS and beating out the initial stress w/o the presence of algae. The rest of your luck i think depends largely on what's in your soil....

Regards!

 

Hi F1ea

You may be over your algae problems by now, but if not I thought I'd offer you this tip, just in case it helps.

Like me, you are bending the Walstanite doctrine with the great depth of your tank. Have you considered lowering the water level for a period? This would 1) increase plant mass instantly in relation to water volume, 2) might emerse a plant or two here and there and 3) get better light to your smaller, lower plants, thus helping them out a bit.

I have a tank 24 inches high, but when it was set up I only filled it to about 17 inches or so, and have only increased depth gradually over a few months. I think in this way, you can give the plants an advantage - thus helping to curtail algae at the potentially tricky opening stages of an NPT.

Best of luck - such a big tank is going to be fantastic when it has bedded in.

Joe