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Re: SAE's good bye!

This is interesting? Some people seem to have no trouble with their SAE and others do.

In my case, I am certain that I have True SAE's because I researched them before I bought them and went to a place that advertised them as True SAE's and they physically fit the description of True SAE's.

At first the three I had in my 50 gal tank seemed tame enough and acted as I expected. They chased each other and did some displays. As they grew they became more aggressive toward other fish, especially at feeding time. They were very aggressive when I fed them algae tablets and aggressively chased other fish way. I believe they were in a mating mode but I could never verify any eggs because they typically went into the dense plants (They are actually rather shy towards humans).

They gradually started eating more and more plants. They particularly liked tender new growth and ate the central rosettes from my sward plants. At first I thought that this was some type of rot but I figured it out after many of the plants developed peculiar U shaped hole in the leaves about the size of a SAE sucker.

I think I'll stick with Oto's from here on.
Now I am really confused. I had the hope that maybe you were confusing with the other algae eaters.
Here in Argentina is normal that false SAEs are sold as SAEs.
But if you are positive about the identification, so it is a behavior I have never seen.

Bye,

Juan
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

this is my sae.in the first 6 months they doing great,and my javamoss grow nicely,now the moss are dying.i am going to get all these 3 sae out tonight.
Yes, you are absolutely right. That is a true SAE.

Questions:
How old was the SAE when it began eating the plants?
What food are you giving to the SAEs?

This is my young SAE:


Bye,

Juan
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

Folks, I have 3 SAEs in my 38-gallon tank. Based on what everyone's saying, I should remove them. I put them in there to take care of any algae in the tank. What algae eaters should I swap them for, should I find them cleaning out any plants?

Thank you.
If they are not hurting your plants or other tank mates I would leave them
 

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he jsut started eating my all moss now.afte i bought them for 6 months.i feed my fish bloodworm ,planton.brime shrimp.he is not aggrassive at all.but really killing my java moss.flame moss.string moss now.so i am going to trade something in LFS,i will get a young 1 when there is more algea.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

He might just not be getting enough plant matter if he's already eaten all the algae, you could try giving him some vegetables.

I've also found that neither ottos nor shrimp eat hair/string algae or cladifora, the only animals I've heard of that eat it are SAEs and American flag fish.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

So far, my SAE isn't eating any plants, but he is an aggressively territorial b*st*rd.

Unfortunately, his territory is wherever he happens to be at the moment, so it's more like a personal space bubble. Any other fish gets to close to him, and he chases them off. :axe: Doesn't seem to nip, just chases. Just a crotchety, grumpy fish who wants to be left alone, I guess.

I've seen him cleaning plants, but not actually eating them. So far, he's a great algae eater, always looking and sucking. The tank is algae-free at the moment, though, so he will eat flakes, also.

What I appreciate about my SAE is his tendency to clean vertical surfaces. He's often working his way up a plant stem, or the airline tube, or the siphon return tube.

I don't currently have any mosses or Riccia, though, so I can't say for sure he'd leave them alone.
Okay, I need to amend my original statement. After a bit of research, it turns out I do not have a real SAE, and despite what my lfs store me, I do have one of the Chinese Algae Eaters.:---)

I got suspicious after the above pics showed nice straight black stripes, when mine has a row of connected rough diamond shapes.

This explains the aggression with my poser of a SAE.

Mea culpa. Or rather Mea LFS culpa.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

Okay, I need to amend my original statement. After a bit of research, it turns out I do not have a real SAE, and despite what my lfs store me, I do have one of the Chinese Algae Eaters.:---)

I got suspicious after the above pics showed nice straight black stripes, when mine has a row of connected rough diamond shapes.

This explains the aggression with my poser of a SAE.

Mea culpa. Or rather Mea LFS culpa.
Get rid of that thing it will get huge.
 

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SAE's good bye! wait a minute, hello?!?!!

Okay, I need to amend my original statement. After a bit of research, it turns out I do not have a real SAE, and despite what my lfs store me, I do have one of the Chinese Algae Eaters.

I got suspicious after the above pics showed nice straight black stripes, when mine has a row of connected rough diamond shapes.

This explains the aggression with my poser of a SAE.

Mea culpa. Or rather Mea LFS culpa.
The majority of the posts on this thread are missing the point. The issue is not whether SAE's do this or that to your plants, etc. The issue is whether or not you have a genuine Siamese Algae Eater! As long as we are not tieing down what we are talking about we will be going around in circles like this thread.

There is an excellent article on this subject, written by a nice young lady who has the website "fishalicous". Please go here: http://fishaliciousfish.blogspot.com/

Once you have read her article I think that you will find out why there is all this inconsistency of behaviours. The true Siamese Algae Eater (Crossocheilus siamensis) is seldom found in the trade; which is OK as there is an algae eater (Crossocheilus langei) which does do what it is supposed to. But the differences visually between the "good algae eater", and the so-so ones, and the absolutely WRONG ones is subtle and requires some self-education.

Read the article and I believe you will see why this thread has been so long and so inconclusive. It is a simple matter of misidentification, made that way by sloppy nomenclature on the part of fish sellers who don't know 'what is what'.

g
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

After reading the articles I have to admitted that I was also wrong.

According to the article I have two beautiful Crossocheilus langei.

Their eyes are honey-colored above, white below and black stripe in the middle. And also both have a white belly with an elongate blackish blotch around the vent.

That is probably why I have not seen the negatives behaviors described in the tread.

Bye,

Juan
 

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I've observed about the same as what others have mentioned here. I kept 3 in my 180g tank. No BBA. They ate R. wallachi and flame moss to bare nubs but left R. 'Vietnam' and everything else alone. After more than a year two jumped out in the same week. BBA started showing up. I'm now debating about adding two more.

Still debating.

Still debating.

We'll see. It's a rare thing to prefer a small quantity of BBA to a fish.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

I've observed about the same as what others have mentioned here. I kept 3 in my 180g tank. No BBA. They ate R. wallachi and flame moss to bare nubs but left R. 'Vietnam' and everything else alone. After more than a year two jumped out in the same week. BBA started showing up. I'm now debating about adding two more.

Still debating.

Still debating.

We'll see. It's a rare thing to prefer a small quantity of BBA to a fish.
Which type of Crossocheilus did you have according to this article http://fishaliciousfish.blogspot.com/ ?
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

I enjoyed visiting http://www.fishaliciousfish.blogspot.com/ to read about Crossocheilus langei and some other relatives of the SAE (or maybe other SAEs :)). Very nice site.

As mentioned, the snout is a good distintuishing feature among the fishes with zig zag center line, as are other features in Niederle's table.
However, you also need to look carefully at the dorsal fin. You will see that siamensis does not have any black edge rays. This was pointed out by Liisa in our 1996 article and is not mentioned in the more recent references. You can see the rays in Niederle's picture of langei.... and possibly on Fishalicious.
Although my eyes are not as good as they were in '96, i will have to take a closer look at my fish.
--Neil
 

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Well, I don't find that a very easy question to answer, since I don't really think that particular blog represents the last word on the taxonomy of the Crossocheilus genus.

I've pretty carefully researched the fish I've purchased and I believe them to be the real deal - C. siamensis.

The fish that she labeled as Crossocheilus Langei is slightly "off" IMO and probably isn't a true C. siamensis either.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

Well, I don't find that a very easy question to answer, since I don't really think that particular blog represents the last word on the taxonomy of the Crossocheilus genus.

I've pretty carefully researched the fish I've purchased and I believe them to be the real deal - C. siamensis.

The fish that she labeled as Crossocheilus Langei is slightly "off" IMO and probably isn't a true C. siamensis either.
I don't know either if that particular blog represents the last word on the taxonomy of the Crossocheilus genus. But it gives a probable explanation why we have so wide behavior discrepancies. Should´t at least check it out if it´s correct?

My two Crossocheilus have never touched my java moss.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

Well, I don't find that a very easy question to answer, since I don't really think that particular blog represents the last word on the taxonomy of the Crossocheilus genus.

I've pretty carefully researched the fish I've purchased and I believe them to be the real deal - C. siamensis.

The fish that she labeled as Crossocheilus Langei is slightly "off" IMO and probably isn't a true C. siamensis either.
Bryce, I don't believe anyone, esp. the authoress, stated that her article was the last word on the taxonomy! She's just a hobbyist like us all. Albeit a very keen one! :D

Also, in my reading of her article she did not equate C. langei with C. siamensis. In fact, that was one of the main points of her work, the fact that C. siamensis is seldom in the trade whereas C. langei is.

Cheers, Breck
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

OK, let me back up here. I certainly didn't mean to be grumpy in my reply. It probably came off that way. I didn't feel that the question was a fair one: "According to her article, what fish do you have?"

I'm not trying to knock her article. It's well done, but I'm not sure I agree with her points about C. siamensis and C. langei and the labels attached to her photos. As such I find it a little awkward to apply one of her designations to my own fish. I do agree that there are many masquerading species out there that are frequently passed off as C. siamensis. Behaviour of these species varies widely. I also don't agree that true C. siamensis are almost impossible to find. That might have been true three or four years ago, but I've seen "the real McCoy" in lots of plant-oriented LFS's lately.

Throw on top of this even more ongoing confusion about what a "true" C. siamensis is, and it becomes the usual taxonomy mess. For that reason alone I'm not really willing to specify with any certainty that what I have are members of the one and true siamensis species.

I'd also be hesitant to suggest that certain species always eat java moss and other species never do. I've had fish that I raised from the same brood with with wide differences in eating behaviors.
 

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Re: SAE's good bye!

I'd also be hesitant to suggest that certain species always eat java moss and other species never do. I've had fish that I raised from the same brood with with wide differences in eating behaviors.
I agree with you.

But I just was been curious to know if your Crossocheilus have eyes honey-colored above, white below and black stripe in the middle and also have a white belly with an elongate blackish blotch around the vent.

Bye,

Juan
 
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