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Would you want to live with a wood burning stove?

9510 Views 63 Replies 16 Participants Last post by  freydo
I’ve probably beaten this subject to death but somehow people keep replying to my posts. So let’s bring it up to the top and start again fresh without all the deeply nested posts.

Here is the story, some people (ie Tom Barr) think that CO2 controllers are useless and some people (ie. Ray-the-pilot) think they are great.

Now here is the story from RTP.

When you control the CO2 in your tank with only a bubble counter, this is the same thing as heating your house with a wood burning stove.

While it is true that people have been heating their homes with wood burning stoves for centuries, there are some problems with wood burning stoves. For one thing it is hard to control the overall temperature of your home. You have to tweek the stove on hot and cold days. Another problem is that there are hot spots and cold spots in your home. This is a result of the nature of this type of system. When you rely on a heat in = heat out method of control you have to expect some places will be hot and some will be cold and you have to expect that on hot days, your house will be too hot and on cold days, your house will be too cold.

So how do people cope with these problems? Well they add a “Temperature Controller” (ie a thermostat) to their heating system. The thermostat goes on when the temperature is too low and goes off when the temperature is too hot. The result is that the temperature changes that occur in your house due to swings in outside temperature are almost non existent and the temperature differences in your home are dramatically reduced.

Now I realize that a wood burning stove is romantic and yes your pipes will not freeze if you heat your home with a wood burning stove but really do you want to heat your home with one?

Well a bubble counter is exactly the same thing. All it does is add CO2 to your tank. Like the wood burning stove all you can do is increase or decrease the CO2. There are hot spots and cold spots and the CO2 level changes with the activity of the plants and fish. The bubble counter relys on the same primitive technology CO2 in = CO2 out. So how do people cope with this problem?

Now I’d like to think that they would add a CO2 controller to their system but strange as it may seem they say:

1. Tom Barr doesn’t do that.
2. Fish can take it.
3. I don’t have one and everything is fine.
4. You (i.e. RTP) are an idiot

If anyone, including and especially Tom Barr, can say anything different from the above I’d like to hear from them.

One other important point: I‘ve said this before, Tom Barr is a talented and artistic aquarium keeper. I do not mean to imply that he cannot grow plants well. He is a pioneer. What I am saying is that there is a technology available that can revolutionize the aquatic plant growing hobby that needs to be developed.
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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

How about some pictures of those great tanks Ray? I mean, you believe deeply in your theories. There must be a reason why. I'd love to see your success.
Re: Please Read This

Thank you everyone for your posts!

I would like to reply to everyone and will try to do so but can you follow some rules about posting.

If you want to call me an idiot please link your post with my original post. That way I know you are talking to me.

If you want to comment on something that someone else says link to their post and I will ignore that post.

When the nest gets so deep that it doesn't appear on your screen it is better to start a new post and reference what you are commenting on.

BTW I expect that any new technology will meet with some resistance and I do not think this group is really too difficult.

Peace RTP
Ray - speaking of learning new things... You don't have to start a new thread every time the "nest" gets too "deep". :)confused:) You see that little button that says "last page"? Click it. Look at that, there are still posts there! In fact, if you were to look at some of the more popular sticky threads on here, some of them are 50+ pages long! So please, stop polluting the forums with the same junk. Being willfully ignorant and trying to create your own rules of forum use because you don't grasp the ones that exist is not a great way to get your point across.
Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

On the topic of what helgymatt just wrote: I've been getting rankled by Ray's ph controller posts for a while now, and while some of the reasons were apparent, the most important wasn't clear to me. I stopped reading this earlier this evening and was sitting looking at my tanks, and I figured out what was bothering me so much about the posts.

Ray - going back through your posts, I found the same theme, again and again - without total control, you are inviting disaster. This is what bothers me. I have a career that is very stressful, and my aquariums are one of my releases from that stress. I don't want to control it. I've found I don't need to. My joy from this hobby comes from looking into a microcosm that is removed from my control. I provide what my plants and fish need to thrive, and they do the rest. I'm not saying you're wrong -I am saying that what is right for you isn't, and doesn't have to be, right for everyone else.

All that I ask is that you realize we don't need to do things your way to do them well. Look at the tanks of those who have posted here - These are not algae-laden fish death factories. They are beautiful, balanced ecosystems. I have never said that you shouldn't use your ph controller - just that you shouldn't pressure other people into using one. As the saying goes, There is more than one way to grow a plant underwater. ;)

On a final note, I also think you might find a better reception if you didn't imply that as a community, we were somehow uninformed about the topic at hand, or unable to learn. You keep stating that ph controlled co2 is a new technology. It is not. If you do a search on here, you will find threads that cover all the topics you presented from 5 years ago(as far as I can tell, the age of the forum). If you look at the Krib's cache, the topic goes back another 10 years past that. Maybe take some time and read some of the back posts, see if any of your questions have already been answered. If not, then a new conversation is always a good thing.

I hope this reads clear, respectful and on topic, as that is what I have intended. If not, Mods please delete.
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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

jan... i'm probably one of the few people on this board who could challenge you on who lives in the coldest area :)
I'm going to throw my name in that hat too... Freydo has me beat by northern latitude by about 100 miles, but it still gets mighty cold here. And Jan, one of my co-workers uses the same system, combined with radiant in-floor heating. It's an amazing system!
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