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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

The temp in my house doesn't change much because I have a temp controller. Just like your temp. controller in your tank.

My wood burning stove doesn't have a controller so the temp is all over the place. Near the stove it is hot, near the window it is cold.

I don't need 10 temp controllers to control the temperature in one room I only need one.

A CO2 controller works the same way.

You know that pH measurement doesn't give you an accurate estimate of your CO2 level. How do you know that pH 7.3 in your tank is not 15 ppm?
If you understand what a CO2 controller does, you will know it is just a pH meter!

And why do you think everyones CO2 is all over the place? If the pH is stable, the CO2 is stable. It is a DIRECT relationship!!!! Learn a little bit about CO2 before you start demanding everyone use a CO2 controller. All it is is a pH probe that controls how much CO2 goes into the tank.

I already asked what benefit a pH controller would do for me, if my pH stays steady all day without one, but you failed to answer that.

Also, did you even look at the chart I linked you two?
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

Can I make a point here. If you want to talk to me it is better to link to my original post and not to some one else.
This causes the nest to get too deep and I cannot comment on your post.
I said "RTP", that means YOU as you are self proclaimed "RTP".
Now here is the story from RTP.
Getting back to your question I'm not sure what this has to do with a CO2 controller.
What does a wood burning stove have "to do with a CO2 controller"?

This is what I'm asking. I'm using round about tactics that I learned from reading your posts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #43 ·
Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

Well I'm sorry but you've reached your limit. I cannot respond to any of your posts since you cannot folloe the rules.

Peace
RTP
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

The real shame is that this discussion started (3 threads ago:lol) with the idea that CO2 levels in the tank may affect the behavior of fish prior to the point where it becomes obviously harmful.
If that discussion had taken place, it might have been interesting in an intellectual way, not just a car crash way:)

BTW, thank you helgymatt for sharing how your pH changes over the course of the day and with differing levels of plant mass. I found that very useful. Previously I was pretty sure I didn't want a pH controller, now I'm completely sure it would be a waste of money.
 

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Discussion Starter · #45 ·
Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

The question is, do you feel your way is the correct way and the way others should see it as? That is the impression I am getting.

What is really puzzling you?

I think each system is as different as the area one lives. And if a person found a system that works for them, then kudos to them. Trying to fix that which is not broken is pointless. As it is pointless trying to make someone see the proverbial light.

So I am asking, what are you trying to get across? are we wrong and you are correct?
This is one of the problems with these nesting posts. I really think that I answered your post. I'm sorry.

I don't thing that there is a right way or a wrong way. There are many ways to get to an answer to a problem.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

you use the bubble counter to measure the change. I'm not sure what your point is? This is a CO2 in = CO2 out system. What are you trying to say?
Bzzzt! wrong again. as i stated, a bubble counter does JUST that, counts bubbles. a bubble counter doesn't measure change of any sort. it's only an indication of the RATE of CO2 bubbles enter the tank. it does nothing to measure how much co2 is in the tank.

a bubble counter is not needed for co2 injection, it's just a very good visual tool to view the rate co2 entering the tank.

did that make sense re-typed the second time around? i don't know why you conceded the point, when you obviously didn't understand what i wrote.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

Sunstar,
That's friggin' hilarious with Starscream and Megatron in the tank! (Sorry if I misspelled the names. ) :wave:

Thanks,
Dave
Where is that at? Bigstick, I did not mean the starscream in the tank as an insult. I too collect some things of that nature.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

OK so one way you add co2 to the max limit and shut it off at night letting it reset( Kind of like the ei :)). And the other way you use a ph meter and only add co2 as needed ie when the plants are in their photo period there is more co2( Kind of like pps pro :)). This is a common debate, even in my local club their are some that are die hard ei and others are pps pro. I think it gets down to personal preference because both are proven to work. It is nice we are a an age in the planted tank community where their are options strategies and low and high dollar methods that work (High dollar not meaning better). Is that not where we are at?
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

OK so one way you add co2 to the max limit and shut it off at night letting it reset( Kind of like the ei :)). And the other way you use a ph meter and only add co2 as needed ie when the plants are in their photo period there is more co2( Kind of like pps pro :)). This is a common debate, even in my local club their are some that are die hard ei and others are pps pro. I think it gets down to personal preference because both are proven to work. It is nice we are a an age in the planted tank community where their are options strategies and low and high dollar methods that work (High dollar not meaning better). Is that not where we are at?
I think it is important to be open minded and willing to try and experement. I think you hit the nail there on the head. I shut my co2 off about an hour before lights out, and turn it on about 15 minutes before lights on. I do this manually at the moment as I have yet to get a timer. Argh... off topic ruminating....that's what I am needing again, power bar.

I think the key here is to advance the hobby with varied experiances, from high tech scientific reasoning to simple observations of aquatic life, leaf colours and pearling. All in all if the results please the owner of the tank, then it is good. Some folk my like strict biotopes, while others, who lack a garden, like myself, may wish to use the Aquarium to get the much needed gardening urge out. I love plants and always have, so I choose a variety of plants I enjoy. Some work, some don't and most simply go bananas.

Since my pressurised system is quite new and I just got off DIY, I am still trying to find the area I feel comfortable with my system. I had to mark the kneedle valve with some red paint to mark the high end of my comfort zone, now I am looking for the middle and low ends. my bubble counter leaked, so I need to get a new one. but so far, so good. Fish and plants communicate well.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

I want to first say that I appologize for any inapporpriate comments I made.

Ray, I could not help but look through all of the threads you have started.
In all of them that mention anything about CO2, you seem to bring up the controller issue time after time. Everytime, you get the same response....that they are not an essential tool to be sucessful with a planted tank. Please accept this fact, and understand why others choose not to use them. I understand how they work and how they can be useful, and I have no problem with anyone using one. I do have a problem when you argue that "no system should be without one, and that there is no sence of control without one". This is nonsence. There are many ways to reach the same result and we happen to have two different methods of doing so. BOTH work! Fair enough?
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

On the topic of what helgymatt just wrote: I've been getting rankled by Ray's ph controller posts for a while now, and while some of the reasons were apparent, the most important wasn't clear to me. I stopped reading this earlier this evening and was sitting looking at my tanks, and I figured out what was bothering me so much about the posts.

Ray - going back through your posts, I found the same theme, again and again - without total control, you are inviting disaster. This is what bothers me. I have a career that is very stressful, and my aquariums are one of my releases from that stress. I don't want to control it. I've found I don't need to. My joy from this hobby comes from looking into a microcosm that is removed from my control. I provide what my plants and fish need to thrive, and they do the rest. I'm not saying you're wrong -I am saying that what is right for you isn't, and doesn't have to be, right for everyone else.

All that I ask is that you realize we don't need to do things your way to do them well. Look at the tanks of those who have posted here - These are not algae-laden fish death factories. They are beautiful, balanced ecosystems. I have never said that you shouldn't use your ph controller - just that you shouldn't pressure other people into using one. As the saying goes, There is more than one way to grow a plant underwater. ;)

On a final note, I also think you might find a better reception if you didn't imply that as a community, we were somehow uninformed about the topic at hand, or unable to learn. You keep stating that ph controlled co2 is a new technology. It is not. If you do a search on here, you will find threads that cover all the topics you presented from 5 years ago(as far as I can tell, the age of the forum). If you look at the Krib's cache, the topic goes back another 10 years past that. Maybe take some time and read some of the back posts, see if any of your questions have already been answered. If not, then a new conversation is always a good thing.

I hope this reads clear, respectful and on topic, as that is what I have intended. If not, Mods please delete.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

Indignation, I can agree with you 100% on the aquarium being the release of stress. The only time I am stressed with it are when the lives within are at risk. When I was a student in high school I used to go to the green house where I could be at peace with myself. then living in an appartment where it gets poor sun, or too much depending where I am. I was unableto have my greenery. Now I can surround myself with green and peace. Which for me, and my temperment, is imperative for my sanity.

I have enough control over my system using simple methods. I can't afford some things I wish to, so I make do with what I can afford.

I've been told my death trap may be my UGF that I am using, but we shall see.

Ray, I appologise myself, but I tend to get even more stubborn and onnery when I feel someone is trying to thrust their way down my throat implying that I am wrong..or a heathen. peace.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

I deleted the off topic posts as well to help clean the thread up a little
What you need to do is close this worthless thread.

The OP has been over and over this topic 1/2 dozen times. Opinions of both sides have been discussed. For some reason the OP wants to spam the board with this topic when no new info is presented.
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

While it is true that people have been heating their homes with wood burning stoves for centuries, there are some problems with wood burning stoves. For one thing it is hard to control the overall temperature of your home. You have to tweek the stove on hot and cold days. Another problem is that there are hot spots and cold spots in your home. This is a result of the nature of this type of system. When you rely on a heat in = heat out method of control you have to expect some places will be hot and some will be cold and you have to expect that on hot days, your house will be too hot and on cold days, your house will be too cold.

Now I realize that a wood burning stove is romantic and yes your pipes will not freeze if you heat your home with a wood burning stove but really do you want to heat your home with one?
I think you need to get your facts straight when using the comparisons before you use something like burning a wood stove compared to C02 use.

We live in northern Minnesota where it gets really cold and we exclusively heat our home and water with wood. Take a look at the model we use and what it can do, since you're obviously not up to date on the facts, which for some reason I've taken personally....
Classic wood boilers
No cold spots in our house since it's run through our forced air system through the *civilized* thermostat, and our water is heated much better than it is in the summer with propane, not to mention we save money.....

Sorry I'm not commenting on the C02 part of it, but why would I since we burn wood....:rolleyes:
 

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Re: Why live with a wood burning stove?

jan... i'm probably one of the few people on this board who could challenge you on who lives in the coldest area :)
I'm going to throw my name in that hat too... Freydo has me beat by northern latitude by about 100 miles, but it still gets mighty cold here. And Jan, one of my co-workers uses the same system, combined with radiant in-floor heating. It's an amazing system!
 
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